Regular City Council Meeting April 19, 2022

0:00:06Okay mayor, we are all set up and ready to begin whenever it is convenient for you okay.

0:00:11Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: We can start now them Thank you holly.

0:00:19Good evening everyone the April 19 regular City Council meeting is called to order at 7:09pm for the Clerk please call.

0:00:30me or come to.

0:00:32Your mayor pro tem mattila.

0:00:34Your Council member for Delhi.

0:00:39Councilmember Fadelli: here.

0:00:40And the Member redneck.

0:00:42President, we have a quorum with councilmember ableton absent.

0:00:46Okay.

0:00:46Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: And that says a pledge of allegiance to the flag or observation of a moment of silence I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

0:01:05teleconference of public comment instructions that i'm city clerk.

0:01:09Thank you mayor for those participating as the panelists please remember to keep your microphone on mute whenever you are not speaking.

0:01:16To ensure compliance with the brown act and to address security concerns attendee images and videos will remain disabled, as well as the chat feature for all participants.

0:01:26for members of the public who wish to provide oral testimony the mayor will announce the time for public comments on each applicable item.

0:01:33If you wish to speak, please select the hand icon to raise your hand if you cannot locate the icon please refer to the document leaked on page one of the agenda for the raise hand feature.

0:01:44attendees joining by phone can dial star nine to raise their hand when it is your turn to provide comments your name will be called and you will be prompted to unmute yourself.

0:01:54attendees joining by phone will be prompted to dial star six to unmute themselves Thank you mayor, that concludes my instructions great.

0:02:01Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Now we'll go to our Council and staff communications.

0:02:05will go to city manager Kevin pink us good evening.

0:02:10Karen Pinkos (City Manager): Good evening your honor Karen pincus city manager here to give a couple of updates, first and foremost update on our current local emergency.

0:02:20At this time, the status quo remains.

0:02:23However, there are a few new details, first I want to know that since our last meeting the county has updated quarantine guidelines so county health officials and state health officials are no longer recommending quarantine.

0:02:36If you are a symptomatic if you have no symptoms and you've been exposed to coven.

0:02:41And that's whether or not you're vaccinated people exposed to cove 19 should get tested three to five days after their last exposure wear a mask for about 10 days, especially indoors.

0:02:52expose people who have symptoms should isolate at home and test as soon as possible to determine if you have an infection.

0:03:00And symptomatic people should remain an isolation, while waiting for testing results, but at this point asymptomatic people are not necessarily required to quarantine.

0:03:11Anyone who test positive, though, for coven 19 will still need to isolate at home for at least five days if you're unable to test, you should isolate for 10 days is for caution.

0:03:20And, of course, more information is available at the county website@coronavirus.cc health.org again coronavirus.cc health.org I also received a message, a couple of hours ago from AC transit, you may have seen in the news that.

0:03:36federal judge struck down the mask mandate for transportation on that was recommended by the CDC.

0:03:46And let me just do a quick update okay.

0:03:50so easy transit has informed the public that masks will be voluntary now on AC transit beginning at midnight, as of as of April 20 it at 12am.

0:04:01AC transit CDC and the tsa still strongly recommend masks on transit, but they are not required masks and hand sanitizer will still be available on board easy transit buses just did a refresh Bart has not updated their mask may day at this time, although I do expect that may change.

0:04:20And uber and lyft have also been notified, that they have announced as well that master optional, so this is a moving target as far as master concerned.

0:04:29Obviously you know the you know recommendations are, for you know masks if you feel comfortable, but apparently it's going to be coming along where they will be no longer required on transit.

0:04:44In addition, many Community members and even maybe Stephen Council members will be pleased to hear that what city staff is planning is to.

0:04:52offer a hybrid meeting in meaning hybrid meeting both available by zoom and in person, beginning with the June 7 City Council meeting.

0:05:04That is the meeting that right now staff is also slated to present the fiscal the full fiscal year 2223 budget to the Council officially, although we will have some.

0:05:16Budget related meetings for the Council in May, but that will be sort of the first kickoff of the major presentation of the fiscal year 2022 23 budget.

0:05:28So of course this is tentative pending any state or county health orders that may prevent such a meeting, however, as long as these trends are continuing, you know I don't want to jinx it but as long as the trends are continuing.

0:05:43We will be planning for the June 7 City Council meeting to be a hybrid meeting that would mean that the zoom feature will still be available, along with Internet streaming which has always been available.

0:05:54That the Council and the public would be able to attend in person, if they choose.

0:05:58While we continue to operate under the local emergency, as well as under the current governor's executive order that is suspended the brown act, we can still offer a virtual option for Council members.

0:06:09But the status eventually we know will be up for review as well, but please stay tuned since again we're planning for this, but it will certainly depend on what the trends indicate.

0:06:18Whether or not we should hold an in person meeting, but our fervent hope is that June 7 2022 will be our first in person hybrid City Council meeting and I certainly look forward to being able to see everybody.

0:06:32live and in person, so with that That concludes my remarks and thank you so much.

0:06:39Okay.

0:06:39Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Thank you very much city manager Karen think us next look to councilmember fidelity go ahead.

0:06:45Councilmember Fadelli: I just had a question for the city manager in this time for the staff, and I was wondering what the status is of the FAB recommendation for the Council to deal with investment policy.

0:06:57Karen Pinkos (City Manager): mm hmm I actually spoke with actually spoke with the Mayor about this today and with the Chair of the FAB on this is not an urgency item because it doesn't have any immediate financial impact.

0:07:09But it would be according to when I spoke with the Mayor will be placing that on a future agenda the FAB also intends to discuss any updates to the comprehensive financial policy that they will also be recommending to the city council, and so it may be that.

0:07:26at their next fad meeting next Tuesday, that will be on the agenda for discussion, it may be efficient, to be able to have this city council consider both policies and one agenda item so after next week, I will have a better.

0:07:42gauge of exactly when that might come, but that is definitely on our future agenda items for discussion, so that was received and the mayor has agreed that we would put that on a future agenda.

0:07:53Thank you sure.

0:07:56Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay.

0:07:57Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: any one else from the city council.

0:08:02Council member right Nick go ahead.

0:08:06Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): You mayor, I have nothing to report individually, but I wanted this time to really plug our boards commissions and committees and having that service here in the city.

0:08:16If there's anyone who's attending this Council meeting, for the first time i've never been involved in anything with Elsa Rita.

0:08:23It is really wonderful opportunity to provide service to our Community.

0:08:28And if you are interested in applying for any of these boards committees commissions, you do have to attend meetings beforehand, so that we can make sure that it's the right fit for you as well.

0:08:38So please go on to our city website and look up because we have a lot of vacancies right now, and your service would be really wonderful and beneficial to the city as a whole, thank you.

0:08:50Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: appreciate that Thank you councilmember fidelity.

0:08:53Councilmember Fadelli: Yes, thank you, I have a couple couple items one is that we had some complaints from local to the sense around the del Norte a station.

0:09:01About bird droppings and they contacted me and Rebecca saltzman who was an alpha beta resident and we toured with the residents and i'm glad to say that Bart said.

0:09:12They will be responding to the several places in del mar to where there weren't bird droppings and there's gonna probably be a future for a Hawk at that station and experiment a prototype program to make sure the pigeons go to some other art station, so thank you for that.

0:09:31Also, last week I mentioned the status of our bring back the fourth campaign in the city and i'm here tonight to thank all the folks involved with making this a great success so far.

0:09:45I can say now, with some confidence that I think we're going to meet our goal and there's so many folks to be appreciative of one is our arts arts fund.

0:09:58mayor support on this program our businesses in our Community partners are individual donors, whose names are subscribing along the website, who donate.

0:10:09And I just wanted to say that all we really had to do is to say it was going to happen in our Community is starting to come together to make this happen, and to have a place to celebrate.

0:10:19I did want to mention the latest major sponsors that we have, because these are neighbors these are people we work with that agree that were important and that we've come out of a difficult time, those people include pastime hardware, which we all love MC.

0:10:39Bart is now a major sponsor junk cat is a sponsor and just today, another major sponsor will be pg&e so we're very close to making this and making a great holiday in July 4 so thank you all very much.

0:10:56Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: ochsner fidelity good.

0:10:57Councilmember Fadelli: Now one more thing is just a reminder about Earth Day on the 23rd.

0:11:02do whatever you can do there's lots of options on our website it's an important date let's make our earth better we can thank you.

0:11:11Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Thank you, and I just want to say congratulations Paul, for the good work that you've been doing and in raising money for our fourth of July and can.

0:11:21very much appreciate your leadership on that and and taking charge and reaching out to all of our businesses, former mayors and Council members and and many of our residents here.

0:11:34North and South, and flatlands up in the hills so you've been everywhere so.

0:11:38Councilmember Fadelli: Mary Thank you Mary, thank you for your help it's.

0:11:42it's amazing just people get it, they want to help, we need to celebrate and get back to some sense of normal, so thank you all.

0:11:52Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Absolutely America timbo tiana.

0:11:56Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Thank you, man, I just want to extend another Thank you to the St peter's church for inviting Council members and staff and our public safety folks to a really wonderful.

0:12:09prayer breakfast on Friday, and it was really a moving time and I just want to say thank you for extending the invitation to us.

0:12:20Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: And, and I second that I wanted to say thank you to pat Durham and and her family at the cma Methodist church over there and also Rita we had a great time our public safety was there and city manager camping us, and it was one of the things and I look forward to.

0:12:42During the holiday season and we had a good Friday, they are elsewhere, you know, and again I want to say thank you to mayor pro tem.

0:12:52Motor Jamba for filling in for me and being mayor, while I was at a country and it's good to be back and.

0:12:59I want to announce that we did receive an email from contra Costa mosquito vector control and damon in business for 95.

0:13:11Years it's a 95th anniversary this year, and they want to reintroduce themselves to county residents, especially here and Elsa rainbow.

0:13:23Elsa rido this week is mosquito Awareness Week April 17 to the 23rd for the state of California and.

0:13:33it's a raising awareness, for the risk of mosquito borne disease in California, including West Nile virus and what Californians can do to reduce that risk, and I want to say thank you to city clerk cali for sending me this information.

0:13:52going out there we're going to post this on the city website and hopefully we can post this on Twitter as well.

0:14:02On.

0:14:04mosquito Awareness Week, and one of the main things i'm just going to mention here to make sure that.

0:14:14Get that we control the West Nile virus is to dump out standing water to prevent the place where mosquitoes can develop from A to adult.

0:14:23wearing mosquito repellent to reduce the risk of mosquito bites avoid being outside at dawn and dusk and mosquitoes can be present.

0:14:31Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: And wear long sleeves and long pants when mosquitoes are out to reduce the amount of exposed skin and we have we truly do have this in contra Costa county and you know, we also have an opening.

0:14:46For the mosquito vector control, we have an opening here to represent the city of El cerrito and that you do get a stipend every time you attend a meeting so if anyone is interested, please.

0:15:02Look at the city website and there is a way where you can apply and our former.

0:15:10Representative Thomas mentor he's a he's a dad so I want to say, congratulations to Thomas mentor down the street, who is a brand new dad and and so he cannot.

0:15:22get a volunteer any longer, but appreciate his service, the last year and a half and and for many years before that we had mayor making.

0:15:34The as our representative to that for since the 1970s, I believe, so thank you to Mr mackey and thank you to Thomas mentor and I hope we get applications for that.

0:15:47Next we'll go to oral communications from the public at this time, members of the public who wish to provide public comments regarding matters, not on the agenda consent items and presentation items should use the raise hand feature to request to speak now i'm city clerk Please proceed.

0:16:05In Khmer where we give an opportunity for members of the public to raise their hand I will quickly announced that we did receive written public comment by the advance deadline today.

0:16:15Those comments have been posted on the city's website and provided directly to the City Council we received.

0:16:22Public comments for items, not on the agenda from cordell himmler IDA pawlowski amy pepito Vanessa war war height Miguel greville is a gora zach weinstein.

0:16:37Aaron is a dod Danielle walters westbrook shabbat allison Cooper Nick brooks Leslie Adams Dave weinstein on behalf of the trail trekkers.

0:16:50And the contra Costa county mosquito and vector control that may or control just shared with us is also included in that those supplemental materials online.

0:17:00mayor, this time I see four hands requesting to speak, if you could please confirm the three minute time limit.

0:17:07Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: is good go ahead.

0:17:18OK, I will go to our first speaker.

0:17:22Actually, we are up to eight hands requesting to speak Okay, our first speaker is Miguel Miguel, you should be able to begin.

0:17:31unmuted begin your time now.

0:17:33Miguel Gravelle: Oh, thank you, can you hear me all right.

0:17:35Yes.

0:17:37Miguel Gravelle: hi good evening, thank you all for hearing me so my name is Miguel.

0:17:43And i'm an illustrator resident and a teacher and i'm here to speak on the budget and policing in the city, so the evidence doesn't support current practice with policing in the United States.

0:17:56can't really prevent bad things from happening, even most of those things it's hard as they try such a second else Rita we have a problem with this feeling of catalytic converters.

0:18:06So police are generally unable to address hard when it does happen, you know, usually come into the scene afterwards, and you know conducting an investigation or so on and so forth.

0:18:15By funding violence prevention social services, mental health services and other public health reports do the county.

0:18:21That have the actual potential to address root causes rather than perpetuating cycle, the farm, we can actually increase public facing and address the real social issues in Syria.

0:18:31Miguel Gravelle: That being the case, even with some of the reductions in the total number of funded positions from 55 to 48 in the approved police budget for fiscal year 2122 there was don't actually increased from the year before that the police budget went up from 12 point 2,000,002.3 million.

0:18:50Finally, as a result of this evidence, I, on behalf of their budget and campaign of the East Bay democratic Socialists of America were dsa.

0:19:01i'm here to express my concern over the city's continue to increase to the police budget and therefore access city council to please change course, by reducing the police budget and investing and alternatives.

0:19:13Specifically, we are calling on El cerrito to pass a police budget for fiscal year 20 2020 20% smaller than the budget of 2122 and to continue cutting the police budget by 10%.

0:19:28Each year for the next three years.

0:19:30Well ramping up investments with that saves you money then programs that will actually provide.

0:19:38An address.

0:19:40Thank you for your time, I see the rest of my test.

0:19:47Our next speaker is Dave Dave weinstein Dave you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:19:54El Cerrito Historical Society: hi this is Dave weinstein from the rail trail trackers speaking about the fairview open space I hope all members of the Council and city staff.

0:20:04can attend to heal so accessible, I may 14 and 15th if you spend the whole day there which I intend to do both days will come away with a full understanding of you know, the ecology.

0:20:16The history of the hillside picture the hillside it was much bigger than it is now, because the fairview open space is adjacent to the hillside.

0:20:25And i've hiked from one to the other, it really extends what you can see, which you can experience it's a very beautiful sight.

0:20:33And, as we know, toll brothers is thinking about building houses there and we really think this would be a real bad idea, the city in many ways it's general plan so many policies it's a tree city, it has expressed a strong commitment to the environment.

0:20:50Even people who are strong proponents of housing, the end people have stated, we don't need to pave over natural and working lands to solve our housing crisis, this is a quote.

0:21:04We just need a permit more dense infill development and high opportunity locations.

0:21:11it's really a gorgeous site, and I would like to urge Members of the Council, if you would want I would even take you there, it has.

0:21:18Two amazing creaks one is really amazing rock outcrops it has a forest topless build what they want to build a lot of this stuff would have to go, they would have to convert a creek they would have to chop down a lot of trees in our beautiful tree city, when I spoke to.

0:21:38The representative photography.

0:21:41And I pointed out all the environmental constraints, he said, well, ultimately, it is up to the city council, and you know with that I definitely agree it's up to the Council to I think really hold.

0:21:54The developer district standards toll brothers has indicated, they might want to proceed without doing an e ir for 15 acres of primarily undeveloped.

0:22:05Land with creeks and trees that's just balderdash we cannot the city council should not allow something like that there are bills state laws that tried to promote.

0:22:16New housing and make it easier toll brothers is likely to try to you know argue that these would apply to its development.

0:22:25But certainly the spirit of these laws sb 10 is to encourage infill development not.

0:22:32An open space, this is not infill development on fairview if it's infill development it's infill among open space development to be encouraged in the urbanized parts of the city.

0:22:43The 30 by 30 initiative to encourage preservation of open space, says the same thing and might even help provide funding to help by this land if the developer goes away well, thank you very much, I did that in three minutes that's good take care.

0:23:01And next speaker and zach.

0:23:02weinstein back you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:23:08Zach Weinstein: Great Thank you.

0:23:10hi everybody, my name is Zack weinstein and also read our resident and member of a democratic Socialists of America.

0:23:19Like me, go on here with your budget El circo, which is a campaign of East Bay dsa to express my concern over the city's continued increases to the police budget.

0:23:30And to ask the City Council to change course, by reducing the police budget and investing and alternative programs to promote public safety.

0:23:40And Community well being and specifically as Miguel said we're calling on El circo to pass a budget for fiscal year 2022 to 2023.

0:23:50That is 20% smaller than the budget for this current fiscal year 2021 to 2022 and to continue cutting the police budget.

0:24:00By 10% each of the next three years wall ramping up investments and programs that actually provide safety and address the root causes of crime.

0:24:10So our position is not that violence and harm do not occur in El Segundo but that policing is an insufficient tool for getting at the root causes of social problems.

0:24:21And is incapable of preventing or solving the vast majority of crimes or harm that take place in a community.

0:24:28it's worth noting that in the last 10 years according to the California Department of Justice, there have been 10 times more property crimes and violent crimes and also Rico.

0:24:37And that property crimes only result and someone being charged 9% of the time, so when we talk about crime and Elsa read oh that's kind of the picture of what we're looking at.

0:24:47And in order to make way for alternative public programs with enough resources to make an impact, something has to give in the budget.

0:24:55Zach Weinstein: The police currently receive over 30% of the city's general funds every year.

0:25:00And their budget has gone up every year, while some other city services have seen substantial cuts, so we propose moving money out of the police department and into alternatives.

0:25:09Those alternatives can include hiring violence interrupters and social workers to respond to mental health crises are neighbors who need services and placing those alternatives outside the bounds of El cerrito police department.

0:25:21We could coordinate with our neighbors and Richmond to pull resources into these alternative several of which they already put substantial funding into.

0:25:30We call on our city council to be creative in finding solutions that can truly build safety for our Community, rather than relying on Carswell and punitive institutions that criminalize poverty.

0:25:41we're happy to continue this conversation with the Council on the details of our proposals, thank you for your time.

0:25:49Thank you, our next speaker is Danielle waters westbrook and yellow you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:25:57Danielle Watters Westbrook: Yes, thank you very much, Dr Mayer quinto mayor pro tem motor yama Council members for deleon road Nick city manager pincus attorney woodruff and fellow Elsa returns.

0:26:07My name is Danielle waters westbrook and i'm a resident of Elsa rainbow i'm submitting a post a public testimony as a member of fair budget Elsa rido campaign of East Bay dsa, as you know.

0:26:18myself and others have both written and are attending this meeting, to express our concern over the city's continued funding increases to the police, despite the negative impacts, to the Community.

0:26:29We are calling on Elsa Rita to pass a budget a police budget, excuse me for fiscal year 2223 that is 20% smaller than the current budget.

0:26:38And to continue cutting the police budget by 10% each of the next three years, while redirecting investments to programs that actually provide safety and address root causes of crime.

0:26:49It is true that safety is a shared value, but the present policing system does not deliver that safety.

0:26:55As an institution policing relies on coercion force and the threat of incarceration, as has been noted, policing can only respond to issues like poverty and homelessness through criminalization.

0:27:06It is also widely documented that police regularly cause harm to black people and people of color here and elsewhere, and we must not continue to fund this.

0:27:14Safer police alternatives include funding for social services, affordable housing.

0:27:19Mental health services and other public health supports, we need to address root causes and needs rather than perpetuating cycles of harm.

0:27:28To do this we can hire non police staff hired through the city or county who can respond to high and low intensity emergencies.

0:27:36There are so many opportunities to partner and collaborate to advance safer alternatives and Elsa rainbow should pursue those partnerships.

0:27:44For example, Elsa rido could fund, social workers through contra Costa county we could also coordinate with non police agencies in neighboring cities like richmond's office of neighborhood safety.

0:27:55Which is already funding alternatives to policing, thank you for this time and for your consideration of this important topic.

0:28:06You our next speaker is IDA IDA should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:28:11Ida: Yes, hello, my name is Eva pallbearers off ski and also Rita residents, as well as a mental health professional.

0:28:20I work in San Francisco and I have seen i've worked with peer counselors and i've seen how they as part of the unarmed street crisis response team in San Francisco has diverted 911 calls in SF.

0:28:32For mental health and other crises to your team of mental health providers providers and empty so i'm here also with fair budget El cerrito.

0:28:42writing to express my concern over the city's continued increases to the police budget and calling on us thereto.

0:28:48To pass at least budget for fiscal year 2223 that is 20% smaller than the budget for 2122 and to continue cutting the police budget by 10% each of the next three years, while ramping up investment and programs that actually provide safety and address the root causes of crime.

0:29:07Please cannot provide to public safety, although safety is important to all of us police cause harm to black people and other people of color I have seen this in my work.

0:29:18and Elsa read oh 50% of arrests are black people, even though black people make up only around 5% of the total population, the root causes of crime or social.

0:29:27Do people have housing do they live in healthy and safe environments do they have access to work, that pays them all enough to live a good life and policing addresses none of these issues.

0:29:38The LCD police department makes up over 30% cities general fund expenditures.

0:29:43For 2020 the last year, we have data available violent crime decreased for 152 reported incidents in 2019 to 114 in 2020 and there was even a 20% decrease in property crime from 2019 to 2020.

0:29:57It seems like the general pattern locally and nationally of the total number of police officers is not directly correlated with the number of crimes that occur.

0:30:06We need staff hired through the city or county who are able to respond to high and low intensity emergencies or not connected to the police department.

0:30:15And do not inherently bring with them the threat of violence and incarceration, for example, a pseudo could fund, social workers who contra Costa county.

0:30:25or coordinate with non police agencies and other cities in the county like Richmond office of neighborhood safety.

0:30:31or funding alternatives to policing and expand and bring those services into our city and also prioritize investment and housing, people who are homeless.

0:30:40pass legislation protecting tenants from landlord abuses and focus more attention and energy and preventing people for falling into extreme poverty, rather than criminalizing or ignoring poverty, thank you for your time.

0:30:55Thank you, our next speaker is Nick brooks Nick you should be able to unmute him begin your time now.

0:31:01Nick Brooks (he/him): Yes, thank you very much, everyone, my name is Nick brooks I am also a resident of Elsa rido.

0:31:06And i'm calling here today with my colleagues at fair budget Elsa rido to express my concern over the city's sizable police budget.

0:31:14And to ask the City Council to change course, by reducing the police budget and investing in alternatives to public safety and wellness.

0:31:21Specifically i'm joining my colleagues and calling upon Elsa Rita to passes a police budget for the upcoming fiscal year, that is 20% smaller than the budget for 2122.

0:31:32And to continue making reductions to the police budget by 10% each of the following three years, while simultaneously ramping up investments in programs that are proactively addressing public safety and addressing the root causes of crime.

0:31:48We know that policing isn't inherently reactionary tactic, which does not actually address a lot of the root causes of prime.

0:31:55We know that the root root causes of prime or social, for example, do people have enough housing are they living and healthy and safe environments do they have access to work, that pays them well enough to have a good life.

0:32:08policing does not directly address any of these issues and the numbers tell the same story, the total number of police officers is not directly correlated with the number of crimes that occur.

0:32:18So, for instance in 2020, which is the last year that we have data available violent crime decreased from 152 reports to 114 reports.

0:32:29And there was also a 28% decrease in property crime reported that year.

0:32:35So there's plenty of anecdotal and sort of inflammatory language being used lately that speaks to some sort of wave of crime that's hitting the area, but when we look at the actual information and data that's available, this is simply not the case.

0:32:49And I can say from my own personal stories and Elsa Rita that oftentimes there's been many police units showing up for relatively small or.

0:32:56Completely just minor non incidents such as a quote unquote mysterious person showing up at a car when three units responded requiring six officers on the.

0:33:08On the block right in front of my house only to leave about 45 minutes later when they found out that the man just simply needed help fixing his car.

0:33:17So, as our elected city official officials and also rido I really do believe that you have a very exciting opportunity to lead by example on this issue by funding impactful programs that address.

0:33:29That address the root causes of crime and inequality, I asked you to use your positions of leadership to fund social and mental health services, support the unhealthy population and provide other creative and impactful solutions to public health, thank you very much for your time.

0:33:48Our next speaker is Aaron Aaron you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:33:55Aaron (he/him): I thank you.

0:33:57Oh hi everybody, my name is Aaron eisenstaedt and i'm also a resident of El circo.

0:34:03As with some of the speakers before me i'm here with fair budget Elsa rido a campaign of East Bay dsa to express my concern over the city's continued increases to the police budget and to ask the City Council to change course, by reducing the police budget and investing in alternatives.

0:34:22Specifically we're calling on El circo to pass a police budget for fiscal year 2223 that is 20% smaller than the budget for.

0:34:33And to continue cutting the police budget by 10% each of the next three years, well, at the same time ramping up investments in programs that actually provide safety and address the root causes of crime.

0:34:45Although safety is important to everyone police can't provide true public safety, policing as an institution relies on coercion force violence and the threat of incarceration and only response to social issues through criminalization.

0:35:04The root causes of crime are social but policing addresses none of these root causes.

0:35:10By funding police by funding violence prevention social services, mental health services and other public health supports through the county.

0:35:19That have the potential to address the root causes rather than perpetuating cycles of harm, we can increase public safety and address the real social issues in Australia.

0:35:31To do this we need staff higher through the county or the city, who can respond to high and low intensity emergencies and who are not connected to the police department and also in thereby don't inherently bring with them the threat of violence and incarceration Thank you.

0:35:51Thank you, our next speaker is amy amy you should be able to unmute him begin your time now.

0:36:00amei: hi.

0:36:03My name is my pitbull do I have two minutes but starting now three minutes okay hi my name is Am I.

0:36:14am reading all the Council members and i'm an ulcer we do a resident and.

0:36:23teacher and I have served on the.

0:36:30arts Council and also riedel and I had some.

0:36:36also worked with the city.

0:36:41On the some speed bumps and so.

0:36:48I am also with the group fear budget for also riedel and I am joining them.

0:36:58As we i'm joining them in their demand.

0:37:03To look into alternatives.

0:37:07How shifting money into alternatives, and I also feel the police budget.

0:37:16is too high.

0:37:18And that we are better off.

0:37:22amei: Thinking about different solutions.

0:37:27So maybe just a tiny.

0:37:31Little not very interesting.

0:37:36story about.

0:37:40You know about the shifting of money when we asked for a speed bump for to on Waldo and Richmond where we kind of had an accident like.

0:37:53Every month or every few weeks and the police always comes.

0:37:59We asked for to speed bombs and for one on one side of the crossing the four we crossing and one on the other side of the crossing and because of budget restraints, the city only put one speech, but not on the other side.

0:38:26And so now what's happening from the side, where the speed bump is actually in place.

0:38:34These cars coming down Richmond do not crash into cars anymore that are crossing from Waldo so this speed bump has really reduced accidents.

0:38:48And, but on the other side, where the speed bump was not installed the cost keep you know at something that is too high, of a speed and should be slowed down by a speed bump in front of a dangerous crossing, and so what we have now is that, from this side of Richmond street at the.

0:39:11Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Time, can you finish your statement, please.

0:39:14amei: Okay i'm sorry anyway, I was just an example of that.

0:39:21That little money was saved and then a lot of policemen come all the time and have to be present and there's a lot of money spent on the police, being the when it could have been resolved in a more in a better way.

0:39:39Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, thank you very much.

0:39:42next speaker is john stats it john you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:39:48Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Good evening.

0:39:51john stashik: john stash it girl surreal.

0:39:54Having had a busy day there was little time to write a public comment so here I am.

0:39:59I couldn't read them all.

0:40:01But it didn't notice the Democratic Socialist Group submitted numerous form letters urging a reduction in the upcoming budget for our police department.

0:40:09As it is the city is already short of COPs and I presume the personnel on the job are working lots of overtime to cover shifts 24 seven.

0:40:19After all, keeping the public safe is job number one and i'm sure most Elsa regions will agree with me.

0:40:27Sufficient bodies are needed to reduce overtime and the fatigue that goes with it, along with covering normal days off plus disability leave realizing that believes where it can be a very physically demanding job.

0:40:39So the bottom line is when a call comes in for service callers want fast response, even for minor stuff they like fast response, then we'll.

0:40:50If anyone believes cuts to an already ilene police force are smart and take a look at oakland or Richmond were some calls for service or not even answer doodle a lack of personnel.

0:41:02The console heard all the noise, a year ago about the funding police and wisely adopted our fiscal year 2021 22 budget with sufficient resources to keep it real safe.

0:41:13I trust the console again wisely support public safety and Elsa read oh that's it.

0:41:22You next speaker is Vanessa were here Vanessa you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:41:30vanessa warheit: hi can you hear me.

0:41:32Yes.

0:41:33vanessa warheit: My name is Vanessa war height i'm an Elsa Rita resident, I am also here tonight with fair budget else rido to express my concern over the city's continued increases to the police budget.

0:41:46I actually expressed this concern to the city's financial advisory board last year and tonight, I am asking you my city council members to reduce the police budget.

0:41:56and invest in alternatives to make our city safer and more vibrant specifically i'm joining others here tonight, calling on all three to to pass a police budget for fiscal year 2223 that is 20% smaller than the budget for.

0:42:12The previous year, to continue cutting the police budget by 10% each of the next three years, and at the same time to ramp up investments and programs that actually provide safety and address the root causes of crime.

0:42:24For the past five years the police budget has increased, while the budget for recreation has fallen.

0:42:32recreation brings in revenue It also builds Community cohesion and it fosters physical and emotional well being.

0:42:41policing does none of these things, and yet it takes almost three times as much of our precious tax revenue.

0:42:49Like everyone here, I value public safety, but the police do not make me feel safer.

0:42:55And as others tonight have noted policing as an institution inherently relies on forced violence and the threat of incarceration.

0:43:03It is inadequate at preventing crime and can only respond to root causes like poverty mental illness and homelessness with, as others have said, criminalization.

0:43:14And this is no way to build a safe Community it's also outrageous that 50% of Elsa to arrest or a black people.

0:43:23While black people make up only around 5% of our total population, this is clearly a case of institutionalized racism and it needs to stop.

0:43:33They say that a city's budget reflects its values, I call on you to reflect the values of our Community, by passing a budget.

0:43:41That funds violence prevention social services, mental health services and other services that promote health and well being.

0:43:49I call on you to raise Elsa Rios currently low developer fees and to prioritize investments in low income, housing and Community resilience measures, including street trees and, especially, recreation for our youth.

0:44:04it's time for the else Rita city council to pass a budget that is fiscally responsible, sustainable and reflective of our Community values, I encourage you all to act with vision and courage, thank you.

0:44:19Thank you.

0:44:19Our next speaker is shabbat seeing.

0:44:21How, that you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:44:25Shobit Singh: I can you hear me.

0:44:26Yes, we can go ahead.

0:44:28Shobit Singh: hi so my name is show bit and i'm an Elsa Rita.

0:44:30resident, I am also here with fair budget also Rita, which is, as you know, a campaign of East Bay dsa.

0:44:37To express my concerns over the city's continued increases to the police budget and I wish to ask the city council to to make some changes about that.

0:44:49As you've heard, we are calling for for the city of El cerrito to pass the police budget for the fiscal year of 2022 to 2023 that is 20% smaller than the 21 and 22 budget and to continue cutting the police budget by 10%.

0:45:04Each of the next three years, while you using the money that would using the money for programs that would instead provide an actual safety and address the actual root causes of crimes.

0:45:19So, as it as it stands, I think a lot of city workers are suffering suffering are suffering.

0:45:25layoffs as well, and I think I would, I would like to see other Elsa regions still in the job and not having to worry about.

0:45:32Their jobs, I know some people personally from the pool.

0:45:36jack Bailey and and Stephen the pool director former pool director who's position was cut and actually he was given a lower position jack Bailey whom was left with.

0:45:46Without a job and without hours for the better part of like two months, and who has never received the same our sense, so I.

0:45:55It hurts me and pains me greatly to see people I know personally suffering, while the greater police budget budget does not a whole lot for the residents, as some of the others have have echoed.

0:46:08I think the city of El cerrito will be pleasantly surprised to see crime rates actually decrease if we focus on people in poverty or without a stable housing situation.

0:46:18And thank you for your time.

0:46:22Our next speaker is Pam Davis, can you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:46:29Pam Davis (she/hers): With a big number long time resident of bills to view California i'm joining my colleagues from bear budget elster mito and i'd like to second mcgill's public comment tonight, thank you.

0:46:49Thank you, our next speaker is the phone calling in number and Dean 397.

0:46:56You should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

0:47:04hi good evening, this is the new thing, Sir, thank you for the opportunity to speak.

0:47:08I agree that there are some changes that need to be made to the budgeting in the city, but I reject that the police department is racist and I have watched.

0:47:21With great in great amount of care over the last 20 years that i've lived in a city and watched how that they deal with issues that are caused by people that do not live in this city, I support the police and I request that you find them in entirety Thank you.

0:47:47Thank you mayor that does conclude our request to speak at this time.

0:47:52Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, thank you very much holly.

0:47:54Next we'll go to.

0:47:58concert adoption, with a consent calendar and.

0:48:04We have a Approval of Minutes be authorized city council and city advisory body meetings to hold via teleconference pursuant to a B 361 see amendment to custodial services agreement with universal building services.

0:48:23d parking time limit modification in front of 11461 sample avenue, and he accept the annual report a landscaping lighting assessment district number 1988 dot one for fiscal year 2223 and adopted Resolution of intention to order improvements and set the public hearing as of may 3 2022.

0:48:51accounts remember fidelity.

0:48:54I can't hear you.

0:48:55Sorry.

0:49:00Councilmember Fadelli: Sorry, like to request pulling five he.

0:49:04Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay.

0:49:07anyone else.

0:49:13yama.

0:49:15Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Thank you mayor, I just wanted to point out that there's a typo in the Minutes of April 5.

0:49:22Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, go ahead.

0:49:24Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: justin Council communications I want I reported that I attended a conference.

0:49:30Not that I would be attending a conference just for clarity, thank you.

0:49:34Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, thank you.

0:49:37Okay, do so, you want to pull he what I i'd like to have emotion for.

0:49:45The adoption of the consent calendar a B, C and D, I have motion.

0:49:51Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: also move.

0:49:53Okay.

0:49:55Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: We have emotion by mayor pro tem O T om and second by councilmember right Derek.

0:50:00Madam clerk.

0:50:02Here kymco.

0:50:03Yes, yeah pretend to yama I remember for Delhi.

0:50:07I.

0:50:08Had meet councilmember redneck.

0:50:10High motion carries with councilmember ableton.

0:50:13Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: absent okay very good now we'll go back to he Council member fidelity.

0:50:19Councilmember Fadelli: Yes, thank you very much, every year, I come to the same conclusion that and I support the landscape and lighting report, and I think I wanted to ask Council if if our acceptance of it which by law means we have to physically.

0:50:35Literally accept the report because I find there's like 50 to 100 pages every year of stuff that we don't understand, we could be saving paper.

0:50:46And I was concerned, I was going to suggest that we are asked staff if we could.

0:50:51leave the rest of the report here and then Council wanted to reach seek this we could do that, but they came up with a good idea that.

0:50:59This kind of report could be sent to us electronically, where we could accept it, we wouldn't be using 100 pages times five or four here.

0:51:09And I just wanted to throw that out to the group there's no information on all these pages that mean anything to us because it's all privacy.

0:51:18We see the rates but we don't have the addresses or the residences so I just wanted to maybe make a motion that this become electronic from now on and use that as an acceptance of receiving this report.

0:51:31Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, thank you councilmember Rebecca.

0:51:35Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): And thank you may, in response to councilmember fidelity I use the electronic packet So for me i'm getting it all electronically anyway, so we can always.

0:51:46Look, to do more business electronically, and then opt in for printed items versus opting out of printed items that would be my perspective on it, which is, if we are fully electronic with the ability to request a printout of specific items that could be a good direction to go into.

0:52:09Good.

0:52:10Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: anyone else.

0:52:13Councilmember Fadelli: The staff have any comments, because, with all due respect councilmember rabbinic i'm a lot older than you.

0:52:21And I, like my paper because I read, write on it, I read it that's the way I do business, if we could make this consistent that these kind I think there's one other report.

0:52:33Maybe it's the sewage report that similar kinds of fees, it would be so easy if the staff, which is send that to us and we acknowledge that we got it, I think that would be great.

0:52:44Karen Pinkos (City Manager): And Council member fidelity.

0:52:47Certainly if i'm if i'm being honest staff would love it if our packets were completely electronic because that would cut down on paper for completely, as well as delivery.

0:52:58And maybe we'll get there someday so we we respect each of the Council members for preferences and that's totally fine, but for this report, I am happy.

0:53:07You know, to take the council's direction that going forward we provide this as an electronic document for.

0:53:13Linkage the city attorney has indicated that that fulfills the State law that requires that the Council review it or that they actually receive it that doing so by link is good, so we will take that direction and to move forward with it, from now on.

0:53:28Councilmember Fadelli: we're happy to do that, thank you very much for that.

0:53:31And if I could just.

0:53:32Sky Woodruff (City Attorney): I could just clarify, for the record, and remember maybe members of the public who might be confused by this conversation, the report.

0:53:40in question is the one attaches exhibit B to the resolution it lists the charge for each parcel that subject to the charge.

0:53:49But it lists them by a pn and not by the name of the owners or address to protect the privacy of the property owners.

0:53:56The purpose of the report is to inform the Council about what the charges for each property if there were a question if the Council then had questions about the charge for any particular property.

0:54:06you'd be able to to ask, based on the piano and staff would be able to provide you with that information.

0:54:12But it is a requirement for the process that that the Council received that report.

0:54:17And so the city manager heads staff will be endeavoring to deliver it to the Council in a way that that works for all of you, but also reduces the amount of resources involved in producing that report okay.

0:54:30Councilmember Fadelli: Thank you, thank you.

0:54:31Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: I like to get the most into.

0:54:34Support he.

0:54:38To have most.

0:54:39Councilmember Fadelli: i'll move this as amended OK.

0:54:43Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: OK, we have a motion by to Delhi second by mota yama Madam clerk go ahead.

0:54:50You can tell.

0:54:51Yes, mayor pro tem multi amen.

0:54:53I Council member fidelity.

0:54:55High Council member bread Nick.

0:54:58I motion carries with councilmember able send absent.

0:55:01Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, good next we have presentations a Elsa Rita public protection classification report and we have our fire chief Michael dougherty here with a presentation go ahead chief.

0:55:17Just one moment, while the chief upgrades to a panelist.

0:55:41Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Give me a little second here to share my screen.

0:56:01Okay, there we go, good evening mayor quinto Council members city manager and the staff Michael goni or fire chief.

0:56:11And i'm pleased to be here tonight to share some really good news for the city and especially for the fire department.

0:56:18Over the years, i'm sure you've heard, we have discussed many times about the city's public protection classification, better known as the ISO rating, which since 2000 and for the city has been at a rating of a class to.

0:56:39just want to take a few moments for those that may not be familiar with the ISO.

0:56:44And the services that it provides an organization that was for that, basically, is a risk management company.

0:56:52That was founded in 1971 is basically an advisory and rating organization for property and casualty insurance industry.

0:57:02It was founded, to obtain data analyze and evaluate communities fire service.

0:57:09Suppression capabilities and provide a statistical and actuarial services to develop insurance programs, based on the risk of certain areas and based on comparisons to.

0:57:23to other cities their biggest or their best or their main mission is assisting insurance companies and meeting state regulatory requirements for.

0:57:37Come on click there we go the information gathered through the surveys and studies.

0:57:42The ISO issues a what is called a property protect or a public protection classification rating that scale from one to 10.

0:57:52The evaluation and the review of departments, based on four areas of the fire agencies operations, which is the department itself.

0:58:03Its communications its water supply and it's commute and its Community risk reductions for for the fire department yeah so reviews the location of fire company basically location of.

0:58:16of war, fire houses are at where our neighboring cities are where all the way to fire stations are APP and it was it checks, how we do our maintenance do we test our pumps on a regular basis, do we maintain the minimum then tori of equipment according to nfp.

0:58:34Which is, which is basically the Bible of fire apparatus and how they are built and how they are equipped.

0:58:42They look at the extent of training that's provided to our personnel and the number of people that participate in that training.

0:58:51And, and also with the of how we respond to emergencies, I think we went a little too far, there there we go um and also you know, again, the maintenance and testing of our equipment for so.

0:59:08In evaluating.

0:59:12You know farther and evaluating the water supply and again we don't own our own water supply, and that is East Bay mud, but they're going to look, I mean their main concern is, do we have enough water to take care of the areas such as if you get near the.

0:59:30El cerrito Plaza that area requires a bigger flow than what it would in a residential area.

0:59:37And you know so they they basically are going to look at that they're going to look at our that our inspection programs.

0:59:46I am happy to know that, because it did make a difference in this year's rating, I believe we are one of the only fire departments in this county that actually go out and inspect our hydrants every year, and when drought isn't isn't.

1:00:01Preventing it we flow test our hydrants at a rate that every five years we're actually testing and making sure that these hydrants put out.

1:00:12What they want for, and the next one that we check is our Community risk.

1:00:19Reduction Community risk reduction is basically our fire prevention efforts that we do.

1:00:26And that ranges from you know our vegetation management that's protecting our homes This deals with our occupancy inspections of businesses and animals also deals with our pubmed what we do with our schools are tri city Safety Day.

1:00:44And then, of course, you know looking into the fire investigations, when we do have that type of event and, as you will recall.

1:00:54Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Every year when we do our budgets, and you know it is pointed out that Elsa Rico has one of the lowest actual fire losses.

1:01:03You know, compare it again to our neighboring cities and within the county with it so that's again, that is another area that they are going, that the ISO checks and risks out.

1:01:18As far as a history, as I indicated before ISO was developed or was founded in 19 in 1971 as far as the records go back that I could find for Elsa rainbow and 1995 we had a class rating of four.

1:01:36And I should back up just a little bit I talked earlier about the fact that these ratings are one are based on one to 10 one being the best 10 being the worst.

1:01:48So again, one is the highest rating given we meet all the criteria that has been set up, and if you have a class 10 that's pretty much the equivalent of not having any fire protection.

1:02:01you're not meeting, even the lowest requirement that I so sets up there, so again going back to our history in 2004 we were rated again, and you know some improvements have been made at that point in time, and we were able to lower our class to our.

1:02:23PPC to a class to once again in 2014 we went through this rating again and we maintained our rating of two, which is on its own, that is a fantastic rating to have so moving on i'm beginning in 2020 we I was contacted again by the ISO which is now owned by a company called very risk.

1:02:53To start our new or to start the next evaluation, this is done, typically every you know seven to 10 years.

1:03:02right in the middle of working on these surveys, the pandemic kit we worked on it, some virtually, but a lot of it.

1:03:11It had to wait until until we were able to one meet in person again and also be able to you know take care of some of the or obtain some of the information that they wanted.

1:03:24we're also blade because very risk which is on the east coast on that office was completely shut down and their person that we're working out of their homes.

1:03:36Not at a not at a high efficiency, and so it took a long time to get this survey that on a good time takes six to seven months and during the pandemic it's taken almost two years.

1:03:51A little bit on it.

1:03:53But the good thing is earlier about about a month ago, I believe I did receive notification that the that the city or that the fire department was awarded a ISO protection class or public protection class of one.

1:04:12That is, that is the best rating that you can get, as I indicated earlier.

1:04:19Within California, that is a within California, that is, the.

1:04:25Basically there's only we're now the 42nd.

1:04:30Fire department, there was 41, as you can see, on this graph puts us in the top 4% in California of the 900.

1:04:40Fire departments almost 500 just slightly shy that that participate in the surveys with it even better if we go to a nationwide.

1:04:52of which there's over 40,000 departments that are surveyed on where that well, I guess, where the 460 fifth but we're in the top 1% within the nation so it's definitely you know great news that you know to be able to reach this.

1:05:13it's a you know this has been done, obviously, you know by a lot of hard work on the on the fire department personnel those people that again maintain our engines, the people that work on ensuring that our hydrants are inspected.

1:05:30It you know it's not just a one person it's not a one person event here, there are many, many people involved and that take care of the various there's over 1000 aspects of our department that are looked at for this rating for it on so it basically.

1:05:50Some people ask you know what you know, is the, what does the ISO do for our Community and that depends state by state.

1:06:00But the best thing that I can say that it does is it demonstrates the cities and the fire department's commitment to the.

1:06:08To the excellence that in service that we provide and the fact that this is verified by an hour or by a third party.

1:06:16And it demonstrates that what we're doing or that we are doing what is needed to be done to protect the Community and again this is evident, as I stated earlier in the fact that we have a extremely low fire loss annually.

1:06:32And it brings value to the Community to the fact that you know if people are concerned about your how their fire protection.

1:06:41is rated in this area, you know as we have people moving into our into our wonderful city, they know that you know that is a that is a.

1:06:51Protection value that they have there, for it has the potential to improve fire insurance rates, not every insurance company use utilizes ISO but according to very raised approximately 75 to 80% of the companies out there do put do use the ISO to.

1:07:14To either offer discounts or as we deal with with many of our homes in the very high fire severity zones and it'll give that if it can be the nudge that keeps.

1:07:26keeps our Homeowners our property owners from losing their fire insurance, knowing that you know the the Agency, providing fire service to their homes, has this rating for.

1:07:40So that's you know basically it's a you know we're being compared to the industry's best practices that's that's looking at how things are done nationwide and again.

1:07:52You know, it is something that i'm very proud of very proud of the of the men and women in the department that made that made this happen for it, and with that that's the end of the report i'm more than happy to ask or answer any questions that you may have.

1:08:09Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Right keep forgetting, I want to be the first to say congratulations and get this tops off your career here and and city of Elsa rainbow and and bring us to a number one rating for the very first time, so.

1:08:25We owe that to you, so I want to say congratulations cheaper goni and our fire department let's bring it back to the Council and any questions to for chicagoan a Council member fidelity go ahead.

1:08:38Councilmember Fadelli: Yes, I second that emotion congratulations.

1:08:43Really IQ only this Community cares about those facts and figures.

1:08:48I was going to ask a couple questions do we have to pay for this survey.

1:08:53Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: No, this is this is funded through the insurance companies that subscribe to well to ISO or two, there are risks.

1:09:04Councilmember Fadelli: And it's not a government entity it's the insurance industry that's doing this survey.

1:09:09Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: That is, that is.

1:09:10That it is a.

1:09:11It is a privately owned.

1:09:14Actually it's a for profit company.

1:09:18Councilmember Fadelli: Do is any other questions involved in the survey dealing with Community drills evacuation drills.

1:09:25Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: not specifically it deals more it deals more with because again what they what they are concerned with is.

1:09:36Is the actual it and I don't mean this to sound bad, but it's more you know with the structures and and what we do from a from a structural firefighting it doesn't.

1:09:48It doesn't deal with you know the medical services that we provide they do not, although i'm probably the next time we're evaluated, because they realize the importance of.

1:10:00Being of having wildfire capabilities, but at this point, they are not rating or wildfire capabilities.

1:10:10Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: You know it's strictly from a structural standpoint for but emergency preparedness.

1:10:15I mean like again they don't they don't ask you know, specifically about evacuation, but it is about the Community risk and what we're doing, and they are aware of of the steps that we have been taking over the last few years to.

1:10:30To improve the public knowledge out there, you know, in the fact that you know we're working not only the zone haven.

1:10:41And you know, and some of the other work that we've done to identify evacuation and public education, for you know, so it all adds up but it's not like I said it's not just they don't ask that type of a question, you know to not one item.

1:10:57Councilmember Fadelli: Okay, well, we all of us have heard about a potential of insurance rates going up, so one thing I wanted to do is congratulate you, but our city council also.

1:11:08didn't touch your budget and we kept fire station 72 open so we're a team here staff we care about you, we hear from our constituents and hopefully together we've earned number one right.

1:11:22Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: And that's, and that is from the fire department's standpoint in my in my own heart that is appreciated so much, and I can, I can tell you, for certain had we browned out or closed station 70 to.

1:11:36Try I would not be sitting here talking about this.

1:11:39Councilmember Fadelli: Thank you T congratulations.

1:11:41Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Thank you.

1:11:42Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: councilmember Rebecca ahead.

1:11:45Thank you mayor.

1:11:47Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): Cheap, as I said, the last meeting I there's so many feathers.

1:11:50that are going to be on your CAP by the time you're done, but this one is a huge one I think you did a great job explaining in the presentation how.

1:11:58This puts us in the same league as really big metropolitan fire departments, and so the Community those three those should be incredibly proud that we have this.

1:12:09And it was the hard work of your team and the crews out there who are doing this, so on top of the work that they're already doing there's so many more elements that have to be done you're doing these hydrate checks if.

1:12:22It is really important that in our Community we're doing this, so i'm so appreciative for the personnel out there who are getting this done and making it happen.

1:12:32really nothing much else to say except for congratulations.

1:12:36Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Thank you Okay, may I pretend akiyama.

1:12:39Go ahead.

1:12:40Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Thank you mayor and.

1:12:42Congratulations chief it's, thank you for all the extra work that you and your team have put in to get this honor for the city and i'm glad that you are able to get to number one before before retiring so thank you so much it's very exciting.

1:13:02What.

1:13:04Do we you know do do we need to do anything proactively in order to so that Homeowners can like let their insurance know that we have ISO rating one to help their insurance companies, give them a discount on.

1:13:20Their proactive things that we should do, or that Homeowners should do in order to get the word out about this, as it might impact their insurance rates.

1:13:30Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Normally the insurance company will know this, you know, but we have done, you know, we have done some social media on this, you know some of this was waiting until we were able, even though it hasn't been a secret, but I mean waiting until we did the formal announcement here.

1:13:49You know I wanted, I believe we should look at you know doing a you know, an official press release, there was one because I did not mention that here, but i'm part of that, I mean part of this rating is because of the fact that we.

1:14:05That we are contracted for service with kensington this rating does extend to kensington and I know that their local for the outlook up there did or has an article coming out in there may issue about it and.

1:14:21You know, I do have a press release that again waiting till tonight was over, and then you know run it through you know City Hall for the people that make press releases look better than I do, and that is something we need to get out into the get out into the media.

1:14:40Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Thank you so much okay.

1:14:42Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Well, chief I you've heard it all, but I again I want to say congratulations, well done on your final year as.

1:14:51Fire chief then and appreciate your many years of service scare than the city of El cerrito and we look forward to sending you off to retirement not till July so but he'll be with us for a few more months but look forward to.

1:15:10Continuing to work with you in the next couple months so again, thank you for bringing us to number one rating there and some very first time for the city of El serena so again, thank you, chief Michael corleone.

1:15:22Like you.

1:15:24Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Next, we will go to the rp TT rebate program overview and update and we have building expect official keep marks, along with Melanie metzger.

1:15:39Okay.

1:15:40Keith Marks (Building Official): Good evening.

1:15:42Welcome mayor quinto and the members of this city council Keith marks billing official i'm gonna share my screen with you right now.

1:15:54See, can you.

1:15:57Is that are you able to see that.

1:16:01Okay.

1:16:03Tonight we're going to give you an update and an overview of the real property transfer tax rebate program I manage that, as the building official now.

1:16:16ordinance 1820 1803 was adopted, and you adopted this and on January the 14th of.

1:16:24Property sales tax or excuse me real property transferred text equal to 1.2% of the sales price was collected so from that point on, that there was a fun, there was a tax for that now that tax actually.

1:16:42cover the in order to qualify for that tax, you have to have do upgrades such as seismic upgrades retrofitting foundations, or even replacing foundations are retiring foundations.

1:16:55Also, doing energy upgrades such as solar energy or in water conservation such it's a brand new water heaters and appliances energy for appliances.

1:17:06Now, in order to qualify for the rebate program a person must have purchased their property within one year do the work and have it finally within one year of the close of escrow.

1:17:19And the rebate will allow them to collect or get a refund of one third of the property of the transfer tax that was collected.

1:17:30Now the transfer taxes paid usually half my the owner and have five the seller sometimes the owner, I mean, excuse me, the seller will pay the the owner, excuse me, the buyer will pick up the whole tab for the transfer tax, depending on the market.

1:17:47However, no matter who pays what the total amount that's paid they're eligible for one third of that back as long as the work covers at least that amount.

1:17:58Now, in order is.

1:18:00It for the public, if you want to get a list of the qualifying improvements, you can go to the blog the notation right here and else radio.org slash rebate.

1:18:13Now, an update on what we've done over the years, the first year that the the attached we're we're collected and tabulated.

1:18:22The real property tax transfer tax that was collected was 3 million tuition and $46,073 total rebates that year of 13 projects was 40,500 and for.

1:18:38The next year, which was when we really got busy with covert between 20 2020 and 2021 it went down a little bit we only collected, we declare 2,000,656 52,486.

1:18:54However, we did about 11 projects totaling $49,150 in rebates last year or excuse me this year fiscal year to date, and this isn't the full year, but this is from July one today.

1:19:11we've the total reach the total real property transfer attached collective so far is 5,000,290 3867 and we've done 12 projects so far this year 51,201 and rebates, so the grand total for all the.

1:19:31Taxes transfer taxes that have been collected since inception of the ordinance is 11,192,426 of that amount $140,856 has been given in a rebate.

1:19:49Keith Marks (Building Official): However, the total estimate of improvements to two properties amounts to over half 1,000,560 5497 So if you look at the numbers, we took in 11 million, but we only rebated 140.

1:20:04A lot of that has to do with the fact that some of the the real upgrades come from my older housing stock our newer housing stock already come fully energy.

1:20:16prepared and also seismic ready so there's not a lot of upgrades that can be done to our newer housing stock but the older housing stock when it transfers is when that comes about.

1:20:27Now, over the years this we've seen how this work has kind of changed around a little bit.

1:20:35started out will we did a kind of a little mixed bag of everything, the majority of the upgrades had to do with our water heater upgrades.

1:20:44tankless water heaters, and also efficient, high efficient appliances energy savings, we have a small amount of the roofs cool rules.

1:20:54door and window upgrades and the electrical charging stations, they were kind of small long with the solar That was the first year and, as far as our seismic upgrades the majority of the seismic upgrades where the strengthening or retrofitting the foundations.

1:21:14The next year things changed a lot you notice here that we did over 50% of the cool roofs now the cool rules help with saving energy, because now you don't lose as much heat through the roof.

1:21:24during the winter, I mean, excuse me during the summertime our water heaters upgrades with 25% and then the solar started to pick up not just solar roofing but also.

1:21:36solar, water heaters, and that also probably included a few ED chargers as far as the seismic upgrades civil so almost a 5050 split.

1:21:45The retrofitting was 50% of the seismic upgrade then replacement and repair of the Foundation was a good portion and then the other way at 37%.

1:21:57And then the installation of race falls again retrofitting found just doing an upgrade on the on the pony walls connecting to the Foundation, taking the most of that.

1:22:11This year, we had the majority of upgrades where the again the efficient water he just which was almost half of that 43%.

1:22:20cool roofs are still a good portion of it, but we did do we did so far this year more upgrades on the doors and windows, so this is how, and then the solar again and still a good little portion there to.

1:22:32However, when it comes to our seismic upgrades the majority of our seismic upgrades with retrofitting again the Foundation, which basically means tiny the.

1:22:44house to the Foundation, some of our older how's the stocks, they weren't tied to it or weren't tied to it adequately so most of the money was spent there, so this is an overview of the Program.

1:22:57We we again we're probably going to we're definitely going to do more this year than we've done ever we're just an apron we still have three more months.

1:23:06And with that that would that's the end of my presentation and, like to thank you for your attention, if there are any questions both myself and Melanie are both on so if there are any questions that we can entertain we will take care of that for you.

1:23:22Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, thank you Keith marks let's bring it back to the Council any questions or comments to for Keith marks.

1:23:34councilmember fidelity go ahead.

1:23:35Councilmember Fadelli: yeah Thank you I just be that every.

1:23:40So if you are going to look at the three options that are homebuyers have or sellers, what is the most popular I was thinking of getting a graph with which to most people check water conservation, energy or seismic.

1:23:58Keith Marks (Building Official): it's kind of a even split, I would say that the most important is probably the seismic a lot of the older housing stock is near the fault line and.

1:24:11Some of the major damage is going to be done up there, so a lot of the the new owners are retrofitting their.

1:24:19Foundations, the next most popular, I would say, would be the tankless water heaters, where they can save money on energy, because it doesn't take as much to.

1:24:29Keep water as it's going through the pipe compared to heating, a whole tank of water like 50 gallons of water, so those are probably the two most popular at this time.

1:24:39Councilmember Fadelli: So about.

1:24:41What percentage of the home sold go to seismic is it like 25% for the seismic the.

1:24:48Keith Marks (Building Official): 25 to 30% will do sighs making a probably probably 30 to 40% will do the.

1:24:55Do the water heaters, and then you have a certain percentage instead of doing that we're doing solar, especially when the rebates were popular in California.

1:25:05Councilmember Fadelli: And I was kind of hope, maybe we had, I mean we've gotten a lot of money, obviously, thank God, from this measure V what's the amount of money that has gone over to be base that has not come back to us.

1:25:21To our city coffers.

1:25:25Keith Marks (Building Official): So we've only spent from understand your question correctly we've only issued 140 $9,000 worth of rebates that.

1:25:35Councilmember Fadelli: through all the three years.

1:25:37Keith Marks (Building Official): For the whole three years is 140 $9,000 worth of rebates compared to $11 million in transfer tax.

1:25:46Councilmember Fadelli: And the question I was going to ask is we did we establish the rebates, to make our city better to make it more structurally sound and to save energy.

1:25:56Is there a need, at some point is to advertise rebates more so that our city it's not just money coming into our general fund which we love.

1:26:06Maybe that's a question for city manager or the staff.

1:26:13Melanie Mintz: I think.

1:26:13Councilmember Fadelli: Our Melanie Melanie.

1:26:15Melanie Mintz: And so we don't actually promote it if we if if Keith pulls up the webpage you can see, we have a good web page on in good form, but I do think it's mostly.

1:26:26Just the realtors who are sharing the information, and so I do think that, if it is something that Council, like you can see it's about 1.3% that has gone back out of the 11,140,000 and.

1:26:40Councilmember Fadelli: So.

1:26:41We have a brochure we don't have a brochure that we give new Homeowners.

1:26:45Melanie Mintz: And we do we don't have a brochure that we give new Homeowners.

1:26:48So.

1:26:50Melanie Mintz: We could definitely create something we don't have what we've often talked about a welcome packet or something we don't have a brochure we give.

1:26:58Homeowners in the city, but there'd be obviously a lot of digital ways that we could get.

1:27:03That out and we could put it at you know we can make a brochure for the front counter, but I think that just digitally we could probably get the word out a bit more realtors do have a motivation right, I mean it definitely is something that.

1:27:17Councilmember Fadelli: This is our city rebate isn't it on our website.

1:27:20Karen Pinkos (City Manager): It is on our website, it is on our website and yes it's on our city website it's always been under city website anecdotally speaking, this has been totally driven a lot by the realtors they are fully aware of this.

1:27:32And they are absolutely making sure that Homeowners and home buyers and sellers know that this is available, and I think that, of course, we could increase our marketing, we can increase.

1:27:44As you know, we don't have a person anymore, we don't have a dedicated staff member toward Community engagement that has heard us these last couple of years.

1:27:53But I think that that is something that we can certainly you know, continue to try to make.

1:28:00make more available to folks and I also wanted to share just an additional I just want to thank Keith he's been really great.

1:28:07That he's been administering this program one of the provisions of the program is that the city manager does have the authorization to extend the amount of time that the homeowner.

1:28:20has to be able to take advantage of this program and I can tell you that I have actually signed many waivers.

1:28:29Over the past year and a half, because of the pandemic, as some of you know contractors are really super busy.

1:28:37And there has been a bit of a sort of a bottleneck there for people trying to get contractors and contractors not being able to take their job on.

1:28:46In that year's worth of time and so i've signed several waivers that's another feature of this program if if someone is not able to get the work done within the year because of any sort of reason and they can write a letter to me to the key through me or to to.

1:29:03me through Keith and I will approve that waiver.

1:29:08As long as everything meets the criteria to be able to do so, so I actually.

1:29:14recently signed a few, so I would anticipate before the end of the fiscal year we will have increased, we will have more people taking advantage of this program.

1:29:22This path you know it's interesting, we only have three years of data, because that's how long the tax has been in place, so I you know I do anticipate that there will be increased interest in this program.

1:29:35Melanie Mintz: I just put up if you can see, I also just put the webpage, which is very clear on the rebate, and so we could definitely I you know, in the city managers, update and in different communications just start to put it out a little bit more so.

1:29:50Councilmember Fadelli: I just think there's so many houses being bought.

1:29:53and sold here, this is a key key component i'm hearing very positive things about it.

1:29:58So it's an asset to our Community yeah.

1:30:01Melanie Mintz: One of the things that Keith and I discussed when you see that people mostly did water heaters, and you know with the amount that it is you have to decide.

1:30:09How much money you're going to spend on your home right because you're still going to be out some of that money for example for re roof, or whatever, but agreed, it would be interesting to just.

1:30:20You know the word gets around, but I think that we could start to promote it just a little a little push would probably increase the number.

1:30:27Councilmember Fadelli: Thank you okay.

1:30:28Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: yeah i'll put him okay.

1:30:32Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Thank you, man.

1:30:34Thank you, Mr marks for this presentation, so we really fascinating to get the details.

1:30:40I think it's really exciting that we have a program like this that has a lot of multiplier effects, so you move in.

1:30:47We give you this rebate, but, in exchange, we get a house that's safer seismically or more energy efficient.

1:30:54And then the third multiplier I was wondering, and maybe this is more of a question for money.

1:31:00But i'm assuming that you in order to get the rebate, you have to show that it's permitted work that there is a permit associated with this work you can't just say oh my cousin did seismically retrofitted my house I didn't get a permit, but here doing my rebate.

1:31:15Melanie Mintz: yeah Keith can speak to that more but there's a whole packet of information that people submit that they got the work done, the invoice.

1:31:23Keith Keith to to meet tomorrow but there's usually multiple pages, for them to be able to, and some of the items might not are there some Keith that don't require a building permit I think there's some things that we allow that don't require a building permit, but most.

1:31:35Keith Marks (Building Official): appliances, but usually they'll provide a receipt for the appliances like stoves and refrigerators, and so forth.

1:31:42Now the permit required, but to go along with that the state of California also has a seismic of great program that goes along with this, so that they they pull a lottery, and I think they give.

1:31:56Homeowners up to I think $3,000 to actually do a pre made plan to retrofit their foundation so anytime you do any kind of work like that you need a permit, but the there's there's only a few things that don't require a permit.

1:32:12But mostly everything requires permitting and then we also have to make sure it's done in order for the for the rebate, to take effect.

1:32:21Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Okay, so that that there is, you know we get some small amount of revenue through permitting and inspection as well, so it's kind of a win, win, win all the way around so.

1:32:31Yes, definitely.

1:32:34Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Great Thank you.

1:32:36Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Great i'm good now I wanted to say again what keep box you keep done a fantastic job sense, especially during this covert period and appreciate your presentation and and I am just so happy that I worked really hard on measure V to pass back in 2018 when I was mayor and.

1:32:58And that's all adding up and thank you for this presentation we're seeing a brand new generation of new families you residents moving to Elsa Rico and the lucky ones that can afford to move here and we want to make sure that.

1:33:18They do what they can to improve their homes, I know they're buying them at an all time high price and and then they're settling for less square but because we're convenient and we're a great town to.

1:33:35And people want to live here and more centrally located so appreciate your leadership Belen events and keep marks and.

1:33:44Especially during this time, and I know it's been non stop for you Keith and and the building department and you wanted a money generating departments, so what keep on doing what you're doing and and thank you for your service appreciate it.

1:34:01Keith Marks (Building Official): Thank you.

1:34:03Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Thanks bill next we will go to while.

1:34:07policy matters, and yes, oh Paul.

1:34:11Councilmember Fadelli: Okay, thank you, I just saw chief bugatti down there and I didn't want to leave without the discussion that the city manager and i've had it's been in several arenas of adding one for fire abatement around the houses.

1:34:27That there's some there's some shoring up against flammable vegetation and other things, when someone buys a home.

1:34:35And I know there's a lot of question marks about what might be included and whether its infrastructure clearing, but I was hoping we could get a commitment from staff to come up with some.

1:34:47Alternatives to a draft of that so that, when the new fire chief comes we can further have that discussion.

1:34:57That that if you know, there are some houses that are completely covered and vegetation that would need like $10,000 worth of clearing to make it a safer house and to make it, you know less flammable makes it safer for Elsa Reno as well.

1:35:12Melanie Mintz: So remember fidelio the city manager did share that this conversation has been something so we have been meeting the building official at the chief just.

1:35:21Talking about this item there's also going to be a an assembly bill that's going to be requiring houses within the very high fire severity zone.

1:35:30To clarify feet from there, make an amber amber amber zero amber I think is the term amber.

1:35:38And so, but what one of the things we've talked about is, if anything, were to be added to the rebate program it wasn't actually written very flexibly, the ordinance so that would require an ordinance.

1:35:48change and we also talked about if we were going to add anything to it we'd want it to be permanent types of changes right rather than something that you know we'd have to be doing coding, so there could be some opportunities, we also.

1:36:01don't know if we shared but a reroofing is the second most common energy efficiency upgrade that folks have been doing, and when they have been reroofing to a cool roof, that is also.

1:36:13A type A.

1:36:15roof, and so fire resistant and the building officials also talking about changing in the building code update requiring fire safe rooms, so we have talked about it, and if if there are changes in the future needed it would be something that you would have to direct a so.

1:36:36Councilmember Fadelli: Okay, so any I say.

1:36:38Their State legislation that would require it, so we wouldn't even need a rebate Program.

1:36:44Melanie Mintz: In the very yeah yeah maybe the chief can speak a bit to that, but yeah and the very high fire severity so in there is.

1:36:50Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: No, starting in in in 2023 cal fire has a believe it's a be 3074.

1:36:59there's a number of aspects to that Assembly bill, but one of them is looking at the zero to five foot zone around homes in the very high fire severity.

1:37:11zone, and that it will, it will be required to become what they call an ember resistant, in essence, there is in addition to all of the other home hardening.

1:37:23aspects that are out there now is you'll be required for that first by feet around your home to be non combustible so that will mean pretty much no plants, unless it is a very fire resistant plant which there's not a lot no mulch you know we'll have to be either mineral dirt or gravel.

1:37:44You know it, in essence, nothing within the first five eight that can burn.

1:37:49And that is coming up, and that is that is a new vision to our vegetation management policy that our new fire Marshal will be working on through this share to get implemented.

1:38:03Karen Pinkos (City Manager): And if I could just add to that councilmember fidelity and thank you for bringing this up, if it were something that the Council wanted staff to consider, then we would certainly appreciate that direction, because that would require.

1:38:15Working with sky and his team, as far as you know, developing all of this, as you know, we indicated, we are certainly going to be watching this Assembly bill.

1:38:26As well as updating the fire code, so if that were something.

1:38:31You know, in addition, I agree with Melanie we've talked about this as staff that this wouldn't necessarily be.

1:38:38Something like landscaping this should be something permanently attached to the House, because that needs the spirit of the fact that, as a property transfer tax.

1:38:45But having said that, I also you know this, you know, this would be limited to only those new you know this buyers and sellers, so you know the law that we that Melanie and.

1:38:55and Michael speaking about is is going to be for everyone right, I mean that's going to be legal so you know just kind of you know that's a good thing to keep in mind that this would be you know limited to only those folks who pay the tax and in within that year.

1:39:10Councilmember Fadelli: Mr Mayor, I think we should look at that legislation for your support and the State legislature, maybe.

1:39:17Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Some cow cities is looking at that.

1:39:20Councilmember Fadelli: terrific good.

1:39:22And then just keep this discussion going I think it's critical because it's a it's this process is working and we're a fire, you know hazard a city, this could be extra safety and support for us here, thank you, thank you.

1:39:36Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Thank you.

1:39:37Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay next is a purchase replacement Type one.

1:39:43Fire engine, so we have Michael corleone here once again and.

1:39:49And cipriani go ahead.

1:39:53Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Good evening once again give me just a brief second here to get my screen up and working.

1:40:04Okay, everybody can see that I hope.

1:40:15Okay.

1:40:18Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: So, good evening once again i'm pleased to be here tonight to present this proposal for the replacement of one of our oldest fire engines.

1:40:29Before we really start as I do want to give credit, because there are countless hours have been spent in developing the specifications.

1:40:39and credit goes to battalion chief Jose Castro home and Captain paramedic Brian chazz rick along with his apparatus Committee, they have taken our standard spec they have.

1:40:53They have upgraded it to to new technology they have tweaked it a little bit to meet you know new industry standards out there and without their hard work and their attention to the detail and looking at what else is out there in the world.

1:41:10We would, this would not be possible right now to be presenting this to you for.

1:41:18As a point of reference, looking at our current inventory you'll see that our reserve engine is 27 years old and the main engine out of station 71 right now is, which is the frontline service is 17 years old, for.

1:41:37The rest of the engines of our frontline engines, you can see there which are they're all just a you know little bit newer but, again, they are starting to get up there.

1:41:48In age for counselors heard has heard me discuss many times, the need to replace engine 71 you know it's getting it's got over almost over the actually has three quarters of a million engine miles on it.

1:42:04You know, which includes driving miles pumping miles idling miles, you know all the wear and tear that goes into into the engine.

1:42:13i'm sure most of you remember, I believe it's about a year ago, maybe a little bit longer there was a picture that made it into a media source of that engine sitting on a flatbed heading out to a repair shop.

1:42:27Unfortunately, not the not the first and wasn't the last time it was there, but you know it's a it has seen it's time for.

1:42:36Based one of the big things, of course, is meeting industry standards based on nfp 1911, which is the standard for inspection maintenance testing and, most importantly, in this case the retirement of our in service emergency vehicles.

1:42:53The lifespan for for these type engines and see the action that our seas are especially 71 is to be 15 years frontline and another five years as a reserve engine.

1:43:06Of course, one of the things to keep in mind the engine by itself.

1:43:11Is not you know it's just an apparatus it's just a vehicle, we have a there is there is a widespread of tools, you know ladders, chain saws and you know all of the different.

1:43:25components that we use on it, we have almost a mile of hosts on that engine everything from one inch while land hose to five inch.

1:43:36Supply line that goes into it, that hose is recommended service slice of 10 years and, yes, we do star hose every single year.

1:43:47Which is another component to that is a class one but, again, we are dealing not only with the old apparatus, but we're dealing with 17 year old hose on this particular on this particular engine for.

1:44:02hydraulic rescue tools we have those those tools came with the engine, they are you know they've been used countless times, both in training and.

1:44:13And for actual extrication you know, there are mechanical they are hydraulic driven mechanical tools and they were.

1:44:21Just like any other tool where's the cutting blades are getting nicked and beat up, and on top of it that engine you see that the person there is starting it's a type, it is a two stroke engine that is a polluting does not meet current.

1:44:40Air air standards out there, but you know just something to keep in mind and, of course, for the last for the last 10 years 15 pushing 15 years.

1:44:51Our fire department is also then enter the technical rescue, which deals with ropes and tripod and and that's, and this is a, this is a picture of.

1:45:01One of our firefighters over the side of a cliff bringing down equipment it's actually a training exercise by.

1:45:09Bringing in equipment down and simulating hauling a person to be ready to haul a person back up the hill all of that equipment again the, especially the ropes they have a 10 year lifespan for one of the big things, of course, with our engines.

1:45:25Since night, which is dealing with our reserve engine and engine 71 since 1995 the fire industry has made some major advantage or advances in the apparatus safety.

1:45:38Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: And neither one of these two engines, you know have front and side airbag or curtain style occupant restraint systems are newer engines do except to and the truck.

1:45:51You know, do have these.

1:45:53safety features and them ABS and secondary braking systems for dealing with are dealing with the hills that we have and coming down the hills.

1:46:03While they have you know they all have seat belts these engines, do not have the seat belt sensor so you can, in essence, sickness sickness seats and.

1:46:13No alarms go off our newer engines, do you have just like in your cars if you're sitting in it and you've got to fasten your seatbelts.

1:46:21rollover protection, you know the newer cabs are designed to be you know to basically be roll upside down and not crushed also with computerized engines and the sensors built and Todd.

1:46:34If we go into turns to fast the the engine or the computer system will take over, and it will start to slow you down so that you, in essence, it attempts to not roll for the engine, not to roll from speed.

1:46:47On it led lighting systems, as you know, one of the biggest problems we have code three is people seeing us the led lighting not only takes less power, but it is extremely brighter than what the incandescent light used to be, and then a lot of other things, such electronic pressure governor's.

1:47:07That that control the pump pressures, when we are actually on a fire for.

1:47:13One of the other things we do is we have strived again since 1995 we have strived to standardize our apparatus.

1:47:22When I first came here every single fire engine we had was different 71 the truck.

1:47:29The engine 72 at that time, we also had the kensington engines both of those engines were totally different engine so.

1:47:39It was, it was a very difficult training, because you had to learn how each and every one of them operated because they were different brands different pumps different control systems.

1:47:52We have now been able, since 2010, I believe, yes, since 2010 and we finally have everything standardized on to a Spartan cabin chassis.

1:48:05So, as you can see kind of in the in the background here engine 71 and trucks 71, with the exception of the year, they were built that they are identical Spartan cabs on it.

1:48:20You know so doesn't matter which one you get in you know where the controls are you know where the switches are.

1:48:27Everything is is easier to use, and that is one thing that we are striving for in this news specification.

1:48:34And again having all the same pumps, the same thing on it having the same body designs doesn't matter what engine you go to you know where to find you're going to know where to find a certain piece of equipment on there for it, so it serves a great purpose to be able to standardize.

1:48:55to standardize our equipment.

1:48:57So it comes down to the purchasing.

1:49:00there's obviously different ways to do purchasing one of them would be developing an rfp and going out for bids.

1:49:09We have since the 1980s, the city has used cooperative purchasing cooperative purchasing puts that burden to go out and get the competitive bids on to another city in this particular case, the city of San Jose that has.

1:49:25That has purchased a number of engines and they do every year, for this is very similar to what we do with our staff vehicles we go off government contracts.

1:49:37You know the police department, you know they they prepare their vehicles, the same way, I believe, probably public works looks at.

1:49:45It looks at cooperative purchase through state contracts.

1:49:48we're doing the same thing, what does this do for us, it allows us to you know we're tagging on to a competitively bid order, it means that we are ensuring that we have you know that that we're that we're spending our money properly that we are ensuring responsible purchasing.

1:50:05there's left staff time we don't have what we as I talked about we spend a lot of time developing the.

1:50:13Developing the specifications we don't have to go through the you know all the work to put the rfp together.

1:50:21We don't have to hire a consultant to go out and evaluate these proposals and and probably handle the whole process of doing the rfp.

1:50:30And, of course, as in the case with the with the San Jose order.

1:50:36we're going to be able, you know they're buying they're buying four engines we're not, but we are able to tag on to some of those savings, even though our engine won't be exactly like there's it's very, very similar.

1:50:49You know so we're able to you know, save in that particular in that particular setting for.

1:50:58With thurs on their single unit price, you know was was 730 $6,000 and some change keep in mind, these are bear engines, they do not include the equipment.

1:51:12They are just you know they they have a different purchasing thing where they go out and purchase their equipment separately, again we go and get it as one complete package put it into one lease purchase again it saves us a lot of time on it.

1:51:29The bitters and the particular betters, and this was high tech and mercy vehicle services, which is an oakdale California.

1:51:37rosenbaum Bauer America, which is actually a company out of Australia, but they do have they do have construct or manufacturing here in.

1:51:47In United States Kovacs Mobile Equipment or K me is it's better known and then the cadillac of all fire engines pierce manufacturing the bid spreads where you're anywhere from 4600 to over $100,000 over the high tech bed, and you can guess the hundred thousand was the pierce manufacturing.

1:52:09So that I mean that was the spread for.

1:52:13On as far as the price for our engine and i'm sure you've read the report in there.

1:52:20And you probably when you when you listen to the news, you probably have not heard a whole lot about you know where the price of steel and some of the components go.

1:52:30But I know, everybody has heard about you know, a sheet of plywood is up to 100% and costs are 250% lumber is you know just it's like gold and the same thing is going with with everything that goes into our fire engine.

1:52:48With that stale or what they call hot rolled iron is over 200% increase in the last little over a year and a half.

1:52:59The aluminum which is you know between steel and aluminum that is a big chunk of what these engines are built out of.

1:53:07that's gone up 52% you know we normally deal with a three to three and a half percent a year increase, but these other components are just going.

1:53:18There just skyrocketing the vendors there they're adding surcharges now that they never used to add cover you know fuel costs there.

1:53:27You know, no longer do they do free shipping you're paying for shipping with it bottom line is the fire engine.

1:53:35is gone up in the in the last two years instead of increasing three to three and a half percent a year on these engines have gone up about 25% mostly due to those few little items, you see right above.

1:53:49You know, with dealing with the metal for it's out of our control there's not much we can do with that I can tell you that it's increasing.

1:53:58rapidly and and matter of fact, the the chassis the Spartan cabin chassis just we got our quotes just went up another $2,000.

1:54:10They are going to hold it they're going to eat that cost because they did give us a quote but it's just that's just how volatile the pricing is out there for.

1:54:22And so, as far as our cost is concerned on you know the high tech Spartan gladiator I mean Basically, this is what we're buying you know the.

1:54:30The 565 horsepower engine at the transmission the you know the higher roof for people to be able to have room headroom inside.

1:54:401500 gallon minute pump is when you put everything together, and I know if you looked in your and I don't know if it got changed, there was a little cut and paste there, the report that I think went into the agenda package said sales tax at 9.75%.

1:54:59that's that's you know just an issue with cut and paste from the last time that's where you know, many years ago, the.

1:55:07That we had a sales tax there, but the bottom line number of what you saw in your package of the total price is still the same with that the loose equipment cost again the manufacturers willing to eat some little over $4,000 to make you know, to put in the extra tax.

1:55:29Because the you know the state they want their money they don't they don't, let us have a break on it so.

1:55:36Another thing we do I mean not only to to make sure that you know we can afford this but also another way for us to make sure that we are getting you know that we are.

1:55:48Getting the best bang for our buck is we go out and We bid and we actually did this ourselves, we went out and got quotes based on that price that you saw we went and got quotes on lease purchasing we looked at 910 and 12 years.

1:56:06We went to one of them was first capital equipment which the city has dealt with before another company called leasing to and another company called Sparta commercial services for.

1:56:20The company and had the best ironically happens to be a company we've done business with before which is fire or fire its first.

1:56:31First capital equipment leasing, and they again these rates are they're bouncing all over the place, but with this payment or with this.

1:56:41deal here the best deal we've got is to put this out the 10 years we could put it out to 12 but you know we're looking at a higher percentage rate and what we're saying we're going to pay out in higher.

1:56:53And just higher costs, and so you know our best bet is to do the 10 years which would be you know just basically rounded off 130 $5,000 a year for 10 years the beauty of this is we don't have to, we do not have to make our first payment till may of 2023 so this will be.

1:57:17This will be into the next fiscal year, nothing has to be paid out of this year, and again I believe you know, we have discussed this before, if not I have discussed with the city manager.

1:57:28There is a long lead time on these engines, it will take us, you know, a year to get the engine, so you know the good thing is, aside from the the downpayment funds that we have.

1:57:40Already in our bed or already in our budget part of that that that the Council approved that mid your budgets, and you know it gets us to this, you know what I believe is a very doable yearly payment to put into put into our budget and and get this new engine up and running for it.

1:58:03With that what i'm asking tonight is you have before you a.

1:58:09Resolution that's going to authorize the city manager to basically sign for at least purchase of the replacement engine.

1:58:20In essence it's from high tech emergency vehicle services, but actually or buying it from the first capital leasing.

1:58:28and using the cooperative purchase process, and with that that's the end of my report and i'm more than willing to answer questions okay.

1:58:39Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: First of all, go to Council member of reggae go ahead.

1:58:43Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): He Mayor of what's really funny about both this policy item, and then the following policy item is i've professionally work.

1:58:56So.

1:58:58I was PS and.

1:59:05Special.

1:59:07Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Can you repeat that you were you were frozen their.

1:59:11Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): Internet connection and then asked, could you do mind a perfect okay.

1:59:15Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: got it.

1:59:16Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): Yes, I don't know where it's frozen but.

1:59:19Look, I giggled when you said that pierce's 100,000 over because when I looked at the specs and I did all my homework for it, I was thinking to myself, because Berkeley fire us Pearson it was at least $100,000 more when we respecting our engines so.

1:59:35The fact i'm so appreciative that we're able to.

1:59:40Use the San Jose specs and quotes it makes such a huge difference for the bottom line we my own professional assessment is, this is a very good deal, we should go in the direction of this and my concern is if we don't go in the direction of this.

1:59:56As you said, materials and costs are going up exponentially and if we were to put this off another year or two years it's only going to be more expensive, so I do think that there is a bit of urgency and making sure that.

2:00:15Even one year lead time is an aggressive.

2:00:20that's an aggressive schedule it's probably going to be more like 18 months from once everything is signed, to when we get that engine at station 71 which our crews really very much deserved.

2:00:31Because they are working with very old equipment and we need to make sure that for the safety of our crews and for the safety of our community that we have good equipment, so thank you.

2:00:41Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay mayor pro tem akiyama.

2:00:45Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Thank you, Mary and thank you, too, for the presentation, I just want to i've never heard of this cooperatives.

2:00:52fitting before and I just was wondering why we work with San Jose or is it do you just work with the say that has the most recent bed for fire engines or how does, how do we, how is it that we are aligned with San Jose.

2:01:09Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: The big I mean probably the better reason is that they are well, they have a recent I mean they have been buying high tech for a lot of years and.

2:01:19I you know my personal preference is is being able to buy from a California company, you know I believe in promoting our state high tech is the only company, I mean there's.

2:01:30All the companies, including pierce and you know they have they have repair centers or service centers in this state.

2:01:37But anymore, now that the last manufacturer or true you know large manufacturer is is high tech.

2:01:45that's in the state and so it's it is so much easier to deal with them, they are close you know we don't have to get on a plane to go and do inspections.

2:01:54They build what we want and, as you can see, they you know they can save us a lot of dollars, so I mean we're getting we're getting what we want, what we need, what we have standardized on without going out of state.

2:02:08You know, San Jose has been using high tech for years, I mean they almost exclusively have there's I mean we know, I mean and I don't have nothing against Paris and I would love to have one of those, but if you know bad another hundred thousand.

2:02:23But you know it's they have a very reputable piece of equipment, you know, as you know, city like San Jose that's pounding them, day in and day out.

2:02:32So the fact that they have a bed that's very similar to ours, I mean no No two cities by exactly the same type engine.

2:02:41But it's close enough that you know we we take this off we add something on, you know that it's there and and they're close to us to be able to go look and see what they bought.

2:02:51It just works out very well for us.

2:02:55Karen Pinkos (City Manager): And I can also I can also just add mayor pro tem multi yama the city utilizes cooperative purchasing for many things here in this city that's allowed by our procurement ordinance and policy and it's meant for.

2:03:08us to be able to tag on to others, is it called a tag on.

2:03:15to other pricing, so that we don't as a small city really benefits us so we don't have to do a lot of work for request for proposals ourselves, so the city council in previous years, has approved.

2:03:26Various cooperative purchasing efforts for.

2:03:30For various pieces of equipment and we utilize several different cooperative purchasing avenues for many of our equipment, so that is a great question and for the public's edification that we that we utilize this process for many things throughout the city.

2:03:47Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay councilmember fidelity.

2:03:51Councilmember Fadelli: Yes, I think I had my question answered.

2:03:55cooperatively cooperative purchasing is the same as tag on it's the same.

2:04:00Right okay okay interesting and I just I just love reading about the computer.

2:04:07capabilities and the new engine and all the new safety assets that you guys will be having it was just nice to read the things that you haven't had for the last 10 years.

2:04:18Councilmember Fadelli: you're going to be having like I have in my subaru and I think that's really a good thing it's a good safety, thank you, thank you, chief do.

2:04:34Here you are muted.

2:04:35Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: yeah so thank you for meeting me.

2:04:39So now we'll go to public comment at this time, members of the public who wish to provide public comments for this item should use a raise hand feature to request to speak, that of city clerk.

2:04:51Thank you mayor, where we give a moment for hands to be raised, I will quickly announced.

2:04:56We did receive public comment on this item as well, and those comments we received were from Jim dog dog on this next them rono Sue and Paul Duncan and Gary processed and at this time, we only have one request to speak, we pull up the clock.

2:05:20Okay, so our speaker is the phone and demon 397 you should be able to unmute and begin your time now.

2:05:33hi Thank you this is Denise sangster Thank you so much for a great presentation to the goni and to your.

2:05:40your team for putting together a great presentation.

2:05:45i'm wondering since you're you're making this really great purchase and i'm wondering if there's any equipment that could be added to this.

2:05:55engine that could help shorten the the speed that you could travel up to the top of the hill as a good part of the fire risk is at the top of the Hill in this city.

2:06:08that's my first question, and second, is how are you expecting supply chain issues to impact the delivery time do you expect that that could take it 18 months to two years out or do you think it's realistic at one year Thank you again.

2:06:25Thank you, that does conclude I requests become this item.

2:06:30Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: It.

2:06:32cipriani would you like to answer that.

2:06:36Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Question sure no problem whatsoever, one of the things that and part of this comes with the more efficient engines that are out there is that we can run higher horsepower and still cool them if.

2:06:52I think I touched on it a little bit, but, on the proposal there's engines going to have 565 horsepower cummings engine in it in the past we've been limited.

2:07:03To 500 horsepower just for because of the simple fact that they couldn't keep it they couldn't cool them technology has got to the point, you know where they're able to to actually produce a higher horsepower.

2:07:18And you know that is going to give us a you know, a better speed, the other, the other aspect is we've gone from four speed automatic transmissions to six speed transmissions which just gives us like any car gives us more gears so we're able to you know negotiate the hill.

2:07:39A little bit better for it, you know it has to kind of be a balance, because you know what goes faster up the hill goes a whole lot faster on the flat land and.

2:07:51You know, we do want to maintain safety with it, but, but this will with this will definitely climb the hills a lot faster.

2:07:59As far as the supply chain is concerned, I think, right now, that is a that is a big unknown, mainly from the probably the biggest thing affecting us there's the sheet metal and.

2:08:12If for anybody that's in the sheet metal or, you know as watch the news, one of the one of the one of the fallouts I guess of the Russia, Ukraine or fact that both of those countries are major suppliers have what's called pig iron, which is a no it's kind of funny name but.

2:08:33It is a major component that goes into hot roll steel it's one of the one of the components of the alloys.

2:08:40There is the you know they're obviously due to the conflict, right now, not that that's the only place to get it, but you know steel factories are having trouble.

2:08:50You know, getting enough of the components, they need for it currently the manufacturer is not is not having a major issue.

2:09:01I mean it's a longer supply time because of the fact that most your manufacturers are not there they're building as they get orders they're not they're not putting anything on shelves, you know no inventory, because obviously that's costing money right now.

2:09:16For it so i'm keeping my fingers crossed you know if if this is approved we're going to have this thing on order by tomorrow morning.

2:09:27And we will hope we get these components out, you know out and coming, but you know I just as far as the supply you know everything is so upside down right now, you know with what's going on, you know war wise.

2:09:42Man I just can't answer that question.

2:09:46Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, thank you um any final thoughts any questions any more questions for cipriani.

2:09:55Okay next i'd like to get a motion to approve.

2:09:59Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): A motion to approve.

2:10:01Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: i'll second Okay, so we have a motion by Council member Rebecca in a second by mayor pro tem go to yama Madam clerk.

2:10:09mayor canto.

2:10:10Yes, mayor pro tem O JAMA.

2:10:13Yes, councilmember fidelity.

2:10:15I can't remember redneck.

2:10:17I motion carries with councilmember ableton absent okay.

2:10:21Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Very good.

2:10:22We have the fire department, I truly truly truly thank all of you.

2:10:29Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Thank you, chief next we're gonna we're gonna keep it with the chief here and we have a standard session on first responder fees.

2:10:38Karen Pinkos (City Manager): Well, the chief is setting up his presentation i'll just go ahead and do a quick introduction.

2:10:45This is the City Council knows, is this will be a conversation about the concept of what are called first responder fees and the chief is going to dig into that a little bit deeper and he included a report.

2:11:00In your packet but as a general overview, this was an item that was part of the recommendations of the State auditor that was given to us in March 2021.

2:11:11They asked us to do an analysis to look at more fully recovering the cost of emergency medical services at the city provides through the fire department.

2:11:20And you know I know the chief will go into this a little bit more, but one of the things that we wanted to just touch base with the Council on is to ensure looking at this.

2:11:33This topic thoroughly and making sure that we have provided you all of our information, as well as our own staff.

2:11:40Recommendation and, as you saw in the report, we do have some concerns about putting this together.

2:11:46But i'll have go ahead and have the chief go through his presentation about what his research found and what he has spoken with other agencies and then at the end, we can provide you with some additional staff comments, so thank you chief.

2:12:01Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Good evening once again.

2:12:04So.

2:12:06As the city managers indicated there's going to be a report on looking into the first responder phase.

2:12:14Just as a little background for it and, as we know, all know and.

2:12:21The California state auditor had informed this city that you know we were going to be assessed under its local high risk Program.

2:12:29Due to the reports of our other cities financial deficiencies and the lack of the lack of our reserves for.

2:12:37During this entire or during the the assessment that the State did and coming up with the fiscal plan to.

2:12:47To you know basically deal with our to deal with our financial crisis, one of the points that was brought forward by the State auditor was why the city does not you know does not charge.

2:13:02First responder fees.

2:13:04This was, you know it was discussed with them at length, you know, explaining to them, you know what what the city or what our fire department does and doesn't do.

2:13:16You know that you know and basically i'll be very honest with you, it was part of it was was an education.

2:13:25I guess effort with the Auditors to explain to them a little bit more about how you know our service works with it, but.

2:13:33Regardless of that and again dealing with the history of it, you know the fire department in its basic element it exists as a means of you know, for suppression, the mitigation and the prevention.

2:13:46of catastrophic fires, I mean that's going back, you know as long as fire departments have been organized.

2:13:54You know and and the services that they provide for their funding, you know as a as a city fire department their funding comes from taxes comes from you know fees that we might charge it comes from contracts, it comes from grants that we may do.

2:14:14But the main thing is, is that you know if we want to look at you know what our history, was it was for being you know basically doing a fire suppression work.

2:14:26For those old enough to remember the 70s, everyone, you know you'll remember, there was a show called emergency that was not only you know, was it, I thought was a great show and it dealt with the emergence of the paramedic program within la county.

2:14:44And with squad 51 and it was also kind of the kickoff point for fire departments to start providing.

2:14:53A higher degree of medical you know prior to you know prior to any to.

2:14:59The firefighters going out and becoming mts many you know many people in the 50s and 60s took American Red Cross basic first aid and advanced first aid classes.

2:15:12which was considered you know, a high level of care for the time.

2:15:20They began, you know we started out as a empties providing basic life support and, as far as our city was concerned in 2000 we started offering advanced life support.

2:15:32To the city for so in dealing with the in dealing again, as I said before, and dealing with state auditor and also you know, the Council asking the questions about.

2:15:46First responder phase, you know I felt we needed just to do some clarification and you know, so the question comes down what our first responder fees, you know which in essence it's a cost recovery tool.

2:15:59it's a you know that that we're providing you know for firebase day empties and fire based paramedics for.

2:16:08You know the question will come up is on why you know why have first responder fees why, because I know every everybody in our sales is going to say you know I pay taxes.

2:16:19And you know that doesn't my taxes cover this, and so the rationale that's used by many departments that do provide or do have.

2:16:28First responder fees, is the fact that, as I said, the amount of the type of services that we provide and some of this you saw in the presentation on the new engine with technical rescue and hydraulic rescue tools.

2:16:44Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: let alone the medical that we do, that the services that the fire department provides has expanded, you know past what traditional fire suppression was was considered and supported you know by your tax dollars for it so.

2:17:01Obviously, there are other people that do charge first responder fees.

2:17:06just looking around us, you know there's a list coming up on your screen here, you know, with all the name Berkeley Piedmont.

2:17:15And you know many of these, the majority of these, not all of them, the majority of these are also transport agencies and by transport agencies.

2:17:26I, meaning that they also run ambulances, they have what is called.

2:17:31Rights for their ambulances that provides them some some added benefits that it that the city, you know as just a provider for ALS does not have the capability of when it comes to billing and dealing with insurance companies.

2:17:48A prime example would be the city of Albany to our south they have because again they are a transport agency, they have a contract with Kaiser.

2:17:58That Kaiser will pay them for what is typically called a dry run if they go to a medical.

2:18:05or respond to a medical and the person refuses to go to the hospital, for whatever reason you maybe they just weren't that bad.

2:18:12And it's what is in the meadow more an ambulance it's what they call it dry run.

2:18:18Normally, you just eat it, I mean you don't you don't get any money for it all, then he was able to to do their own contract reasoning that hey we're saving you money you know, because this person didn't require to come in.

2:18:35And so they were able, you know they were able to convince them to do that for so again if you're a transport agency, it opens a lot of doors for you, but.

2:18:47You know that's I mean Obviously we are not a transport agency so and looking at all of these different agencies that was just up on the screen their charges run from 350 to $650.

2:19:04This information is probably four months old now so maybe up a little bit, but you know it's somewhere in that neighborhood.

2:19:13Your costs.

2:19:15Of what you charge as a first responder fee has to be based on what you're actually spending so it in essence.

2:19:24For the city to do this, we would have to do a cost analysis of when that engine responds the gear that we use, you know, whatever medical equipment, we use.

2:19:34We need to come up with an actual I mean a cost that you can support you know with you know with facts, not just this sounds like a good number type deal.

2:19:46So so that's that is one of the steps and we'll talk about a number of the steps as we go on here in a little bit, so the next question comes out who pays first responder fees.

2:19:59Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: And pretty much there's four areas that are for places to get for people to pay for first responder fees One of those is going to be commercial insurance companies, you know, whether it be sutter blue cross.

2:20:15You know Kaiser that I just mentioned, or you're going to have medicare or you're going to have medicaid.

2:20:23or you're going to have private pay private pay is basically people without insurance and they're going to pay for it out of their pocket but also keep in mind that that includes you know that includes on house people that includes.

2:20:38You know, low income people that may not have any insurance, and so what comes down to is that you know, are we going to are we going to just accept what insurance does, or are we going to.

2:20:51You know, we got to somehow or another, try to force people to pay that you know if they don't have any other means no insurance to pay these bills for.

2:21:02One thing we do know is that medicare and medicaid do not pay at least at least to get like a city like ourselves, they do not pay for first responder fees, you know they do pay if we were a transport agency, there are things that they pay their.

2:21:21We do know that some Kaiser plans and unfortunately I can't tell you, if all the Kaiser plants, we do know that some Kaiser plans do not pay for first responder fees.

2:21:32And then, again, as I said, you have the potential private pay every agency that I dealt with have what they call compassionate billing.

2:21:42was basically means if your insurance company doesn't pay for it, we write it off.

2:21:48You know there's some agencies that you know right off close to, if not over a million dollars, if the fees of first responder fees due to compassionate billing and not you know basically not making other people, you know, have to pay for.

2:22:09So looking into the facts fire department, and these are current these are current facts we respond to roughly.

2:22:1930 750 calls every year annual calls now that's all calls that's fires that's medicals that's accidents it's it's everything for.

2:22:29Roughly 250 of them are medical calls another 250 or public assess calls the public assess calls, as you know, a fallen I can't get up you know we go help somebody.

2:22:42move from their wheelchair to their bed, or you know it's not a medical it literally is a public assessed and then one of the one of the crime or one of the interesting facts about our city.

2:22:54Because the fire department does not go to code to calls, there are about 2000 ambulance oh my calls every year in the city of El cerrito.

2:23:05These are, these are transports, you know Someone needs to someone's coming home from the hospital Someone needs to go, for you know some sort of treatment or you know they basically need to be you know moved.

2:23:19it's just if they're injured but it's just strictly a code to call they don't need fire it's not a life threatening call.

2:23:27there's that many calls and in our area, obviously, those are not calls that we can that we can that we could charge a an ambulance bill on for another factor to keep into.

2:23:42is to keep into consideration, and this comes from dealing or talking with.

2:23:49The third party billing companies is that only about 25 to 35% of the responses are basically calls that we go to are covered by private insurance.

2:24:01And so, and then at that for those that insurance will pay they typically pay like 80 to 90% of what you charge another big item with you know with this program.

2:24:16And I talked about the fact that we had 1200 roughly or more or less 1200 and 50 medicals a year.

2:24:22We have to keep in mind 35% of those responses are outside our city jurisdiction now what does that mean.

2:24:31We we run auto aid with Richmond we go into Richmond provide aid, we cannot charge first responder fees and the city of Richmond unless there is some way to work out an agreement with them, we cover the city or the community of kensington.

2:24:48We can't do that is that we do not have we have jurisdiction as far as fires concerned up there, but kensington any ordinance that the city comes up with is not going to work.

2:25:01is not going to be a pliable into kensington you know that doesn't mean kensington you know we can't work out a deal and talk kinsey again into adopting the same type of.

2:25:12The same type of program but right now, we would have to write off another 35% of those responses, because they're not within the city for and then also according to the.

2:25:25census 20% of our city population is over 65 Why do I say that i'm the only because you know it's obvious it mean typically the people that are needing medical care tend to be.

2:25:40You know, tends to be our senior people within the city for.

2:25:44Typically, our senior people more of those have are going to have the you know medicare or they're going just because it's the one I mean it's kind of the main hospital and Sarah they may have a Kaiser plan for.

2:25:57So you know that's going to cut down on what our ability to to be able to read or, to be able to successfully get first responder fees out of it.

2:26:09So, looking at potential revenue based on, you know how many how many calls, we could get based on the fact of what.

2:26:19On what the how many calls we go to in either richman or the county or up in the kensington we're looking upwards.

2:26:28Of 290 incidents that are very that could possibly be billable to a commercial assurance now if we just take a round number and again, it would have to be verified if we just say $500.

2:26:42per call that would kick us upwards of $140,000 annually in the best case scenario that's meaning they pay 100% that means every one of those commercial.

2:26:55Companies you know do pay and that they pay 100% and realistically and this is based on two different agencies is that it would prop in which is.

2:27:07In talking or in looking at albany's a bill or looking at what their returns are and also looking at East contra Costa, you know realistically we're probably going to realize about $50,000 annually for it.

2:27:25Just as a just as an example, I got three little over three and a half years from Albany of their fire of their.

2:27:36of their first responder revenues back by the time of what they wrote off, and this is even with an agreement with Kaiser for dry runs over three years, they averaged about $199 per call with it so again, if you take you know, looking at even rounding it off to 300 you know 300 incidents.

2:28:01You know, and again everybody paying that puts us up and about the $60,000 range of what we could get from it, which again is you know, is nothing to to ignore until you start thinking about the fact that.

2:28:17You got a third you're going to have a third party billing company they're going to take their fair share of it.

2:28:24And you know they're we're going to need we're going to need an additional staff person for dealing with the paperwork to get to the third billing company.

2:28:33that's going to take some money out of it, and you know, so I mean between staff time and billing companies that's going to cut that fee down.

2:28:42Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: But what do we have to do if the Council is is in favor of pushing forward with this.

2:28:49Is the biggest thing we have to do is, we need to determine the legal requirement of what we have to do for implementing these fees, it will, I know, it can be done because other cities are doing it, but we just can't automatically do it, it will take.

2:29:05It will take you know basically either an ordinance or a resolution, I will have to be put together.

2:29:12And passed, and you know to basically make it legal for us to do this will have to you know look for outside consultant company to verify what the true costs are for providing the services on time to the to the first item up there, obviously we have to amend our municipal code.

2:29:31You know, for doing this, we would have to you know just develop this whole plan once we've made it legal once we know what our costs are on there still a lot of work to put the plan together.

2:29:46You know so and again fire department does not have the staff I don't believe finance has the staff right now to do it.

2:29:54You know, this would require outside help to develop and implement the program and, of course, as I stated before, we would have to hire a third party billing service of which there's a couple of very good ones that these local departments are using.

2:30:10And i've already talked about you know hiring someone to manage the program we would have to initiate a public education program you know, the last thing we want is people to start getting bills from us and say what.

2:30:24And then obviously established what the operational protocols are firefighters, are going to have to make sure that we get you know insurance information if.

2:30:35and basically make sure that, because the ambulance will obviously be getting it, but we need to make sure that we have it, which requires again a whole training Regiment for the fire personnel to deal with on this thing.

2:30:49And unfortunately I think it's going to have there's going to be a higher impact on our low income residents and our seniors and.

2:30:58I think it will give you will give some of our people, the potential reason not to call for medical services because.

2:31:06Even if we have compassionate billing we're going to have some of our.

2:31:10we're going to have some of our people are going to say you know I can't call for an ambulance because the fire department's going to show up and and I can't afford that bill so that's you know that could potentially you know increase or or be detrimental to their health.

2:31:26already talked about the fact that it's increasing the administrative work and the you know what we actually in the end, the actual revenue may be disproportionate.

2:31:37disproportionate to the as we compare it to the effort we've got to put in to make this to make this fee happen for.

2:31:47With that it's, that is the end of my report, and I am I am open for questions.

2:31:54Good oh.

2:31:56I was gonna say.

2:31:57Karen Pinkos (City Manager): Sorry mayor just to wrap up, I think that Thank you chief that was excellent is as far as outlining everything I think the chief really kind of nailed it especially near the end.

2:32:09With the the big concerns that staff has in implementing such a fee, it does seem like a lot of effort for not as much reward.

2:32:17And i'm particularly concerned with the equity conversation, as far as this would have a disproportionate.

2:32:23If this were a staff report councilmember fidelio would put under equity considerations, this would have a disproportionate impact on our lower income residents in our seniors and perhaps people of color.

2:32:34And i'm really concerned about the disincentive of calling for service, so you know, having said all of that those are our staff concerns and that's what we're giving you all of that information.

2:32:46So that you have that ability to ask us questions having again having said that, if this was something that the Council wanted us to pursue, we would appreciate that direction tonight, so that we could initiate the process, so thank you chief and thank you mayor for this opportunity.

2:33:02Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Thank you city manager care pincus will go to councilmember Robin.

2:33:07Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): Thank you mayor, as I said during the last item, these are two things that i've worked on and when I first knew that this presentation was coming.

2:33:17Just all so much ptsd came back to me around this project, I worked on for city of Berkeley and billing and it is an incredibly complex and.

2:33:27i'm chief pagoda, you said that you know the these compassionate right officer a million dollars in Berkeley I believe it was anywhere from 3 million to 6 million for its first right, so it was much more significant than that and.

2:33:42We are we're not a transport agency so some of the smaller cities like Piedmont and Albany you think well they're small their calls of service, probably are aligned with ours.

2:33:54Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): And they're still doing it, however, they are the transport agencies you touched on it a little bit, but to kind of give context.

2:34:03it's going to impact the cruise and that the crews now need to have a sense of what then the billing structure becomes for the patient so after they've dealt with the patient, depending on what.

2:34:16What is going on, then they need to not only go through the insurance and documentation and then knowing more about the specifics of what it was that was done so that because that.

2:34:27That billing could potentially be a sliding scale, depending on what service was done there's a lot of complexities to it long story short, the juice is just not worth the squeeze.

2:34:38is how I feel, and I think that you know we at this point are operating in a way that's the cost of doing business and there.

2:34:46You know, until there is a better way of doing it, I think that this is a better way of doing it.

2:34:54Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: For the mayor pro tem O D Allah.

2:34:58Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Thank you mayor and thank you chief.

2:35:02I really appreciate the explanation of of how this works, because when I when I read the comment from the auditor initially.

2:35:10It made sense that there's a fee that we could be charging that we ought to be charging and we're not doing it, but you know from your explanation and just kind of.

2:35:23Have you walk me through this it's really.

2:35:28I don't think people in the public quite understand that this is, you know the ambulance will come to your House and you get charged for the ambulance.

2:35:38That is one charge, and on top of that you'll get a separate bill for whatever you know, for having had the fire department come to your House.

2:35:46So those two things in our town would not be coupled together, and I would say that it would not make a whole lot of sense to people when they put put in that call for help.

2:35:58So I think that this is, you know, a pretty hearts, you know this is this is definitely a time or kind of servers where where someone would say, but I already pay taxes for this.

2:36:11And I think that it just doesn't really make sense, the way that we're structured and you know as councilmember running said, this is that worth the effort here to try to extend just really extracting more funds from people in a moment when they really are in need, so.

2:36:31I don't you know, this is a budget thing and totally to buy these things but i'm not into this one, just because.

2:36:38It won't make sense.

2:36:40And I would imagine that the bulk of the time we'd be doing that compassionate billing and not going after people, and you know in talking with city manager about this.

2:36:51it's super clear that it's not that the bill isn't going to go out people will be billed that some people will know not to pay it.

2:37:00or some people may you know, have to hurt themselves to forego something medicine or rent to make that payment and there's no way for us to now.

2:37:11If people really need the compassionate doing either, so I think that there is a disproportionate impact on people, particularly the least able to pay.

2:37:20And there's no way to say hey it's Okay, not to pay it because it's compact and filling nobody's gonna fit in and work, then, so the question comes back around like Why would we.

2:37:30implement this in the first place, so I really appreciate all the time and effort you put into this chief and promoting and I really.

2:37:39Am so appreciative of all your expertise tonight, has been like the chief ago T shirt explain things to us, and so I do really appreciate having your expertise here and i'm certainly going to miss it when you're not able to give us these really detailed presentation, so thank you.

2:37:56Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: you're welcome, and thank you.

2:37:58Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: councilmember fidelity.

2:37:59Councilmember Fadelli: Thank you.

2:38:02It certainly does sound like an administrative burden that's costly costly burden.

2:38:09I was going to ask city manager the audit response when would we respond back at the next report and did you have any indication about how how much they prioritize this recommendation.

2:38:25Karen Pinkos (City Manager): that's a good question because I they really didn't prioritize the recommendations as far as ones that seem to be more important than the others, though I mean we've actually focused.

2:38:37mostly on all of the budgetary ones.

2:38:40This is a budgetary one but more of like the deep dive into what is reported and what is being you know you know the reserve policy and those type of really.

2:38:49More technical budget issues, as opposed to sort of you know, the what adds to the budget or subtracts from the budget and increasing revenue, for example.

2:38:58We would report next to the State auditor in September we're required to report every six months and I haven't heard from.

2:39:06That we did submit a report about a month ago, and I haven't heard anything from them, yet low admit I haven't checked the website for updates, but I haven't heard anything from them, yet myself.

2:39:17So I assumed that we would just go ahead and and report that to them at the next update, but having said that, I think that what we would be able to say.

2:39:24Is you know, whatever the City Council decides, we would report that to them if the Council decided to move forward, wherever we.

2:39:32were at with this we would report that in September, but if the Council decides not to move forward with this, then that that would be completed, and we would just let them know that that's what the Council considered it and looked at it and researched it and made this decision.

2:39:47Councilmember Fadelli: To pagani Why would else we do not want to be a transport agency.

2:39:54Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Why would we not want to be a transport at.

2:39:56Night well.

2:39:57Councilmember Fadelli: I don't know why.

2:39:58yeah.

2:40:00Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: One biggest reason is, we would have to fight for the rights to be transport because contra Costa county has that right in our city right now with it second would be startup costs, as you saw how many calls, you know over 2000 calls a year in our city.

2:40:19an ambulance it would take a place to put these ambulances, it would take you know our fire stations are not capable of you know, handling.

2:40:29Additional.

2:40:31Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: I think.

2:40:32Councilmember Fadelli: The Albany.

2:40:33Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: startup costs.

2:40:34Councilmember Fadelli: Why, why does Albany want to be a transport agency I don't get what's the value of that.

2:40:40Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Well, I mean they make money off of their ambulance I mean i'm not saying we can't make it is just.

2:40:46Councilmember Fadelli: Adding on to what.

2:40:47Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: You know they have been you know just like Berkeley just like Piedmont, just like alameda I mean they've all been as long as I can remember.

2:40:58know they have been in the ambulance business is you know when you've been doing it from for a long time, you know, but I mean to go in and try to steal area from somebody that's got the contract for this area.

2:41:12It is not, it is not an easy process to do, I live in a county where there's a consolidation trying to take over ambulance rights in certain places, and you know it is a battle.

2:41:24But as I, or just the start up to the House to buy it and how's it.

2:41:31Councilmember Fadelli: got.

2:41:31Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: dream money.

2:41:32Karen Pinkos (City Manager): and ensure it.

2:41:34And sure enough.

2:41:36Councilmember Fadelli: When the new fire engine that we've talked about tonight go on these trips to help people with heart attacks.

2:41:42Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: Oh yes, no it, I mean we this new engine will do everything as far as type of calls it goes to will go to all the same calls that the existing ones go to so you know we're fully.

2:41:55Smart expand feel, for it will be a fully equipped, just like the rest of our fire engines okay.

2:42:03Councilmember Fadelli: i'm just kind of um.

2:42:04it's good to see this in writing because we've talked about it for a couple years a lot of people have asked us we have citizen residents that say why aren't you doing this.

2:42:14And I think we have a better understanding, thanks to your presentation for why it would be a burden and i'm kind of going from doing this as losing money, possibly.

2:42:25To this is one of the great assets that Elsa widows providing our residents for the taxes they pay.

2:42:31And that's kind of making me proud at the end of this little discussion here, so thank you for that sounds like we're going to go on continuing to help keep our residents safe with response and we'll see where we go from there, thank you.

2:42:45Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay councilmember Rebecca.

2:42:48Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): paul's question actually inspired a question for me, which is.

2:42:52In our.

2:42:53In our ALS response i'm sure we intubate, but do we also provide our products.

2:42:58Yes, Okay, because that would be a barrier for one of the things about being a transport agency is that you then.

2:43:04need to have a lot of different narcotics that you give to patients and then you need to have a physician on staff or contract, so that you could get those narcotics and then that's a whole another complex system.

2:43:16Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: You know, we have.

2:43:18We we carry narcotics every one of our engines has a digital safe on it to keep them stored.

2:43:28A whole inventory system there's a whole program on dealing with the narcotics.

2:43:35Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, good so um I wanted to say, I support of what my colleagues have said, I agree with them, I want to say thank you to cipriani for this thorough study session on this and.

2:43:55To to finally get this and to realize it just doesn't add up, I see that as well and matt I thank you Cameron, and we will.

2:44:06Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: You know, inform the state auditor and we'll go from there, so again, thank you, chief gunny it was your night all evening this evening and appreciate all your work and, again, thank you.

2:44:20If I may, we do need to.

2:44:21Be public comment on this item and we do have at least one hand raised.

2:44:25Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay let's go with that that Thank you.

2:44:27Thank you so quickly i'll just announced that we did receive public written public comments on this item from Maria good della Sue and Paul Duncan and sherry dropping her we do have a couple of requests to speak.

2:44:40pull up our clock.

2:44:48Okay, I will go to our first speaker, which is Denise being stirred you should be able to unmute to begin your time now.

2:45:04Nice are you still with us.

2:45:08hi Thank you very much today sangster to thank you very much for that report.

2:45:14I studied these.

2:45:16With the assistance of the counties association, I presented Scott Hannon with a pretty comprehensive review of these programs in 2004 and our current city manager, I know, reviewed it with him.

2:45:31These programs, there are there are other alternatives out there that other cities are using.

2:45:37And i'm a little disheartened to hear that the Council doesn't want to take us to the next step, I think it's really unfortunate, although I I do agree with Council member.

2:45:51fidelity that this is an asset to the residents, but the services are provided to non residents as well and, as our partner and more youth, and we have responses there.

2:46:03People are at their homes and don't live here I think it's completely appropriate to charge us, especially for advanced life savings.

2:46:12And even basic basic life savings those responses, so I would like the Council to ask for this to continue.

2:46:20And to look at alternatives that are being different forms of this that are in current use in southern California extensively.

2:46:30And there are some different models in northern California as well, I think it's worth it.

2:46:35As a resident that pays into this sure I don't want to pay any more for it but i'm happy.

2:46:41To pay i'm happy to have my insurance build and, if you want to write off the rest of it that's your that's your decision, but there are legitimate reasons to pursue this further, and I would like to see that done Thank you.

2:46:55Thank you, our next speaker is john stashes.

2:46:59Johnny should be able to unmute him begin your time now.

2:47:03john stashik: Thank you G for hanging in here all Tuesday night in 10 days you're going to have some really exceptional Tuesday nights because you won't have to go through this anymore we've talked about this a year ago and beyond.

2:47:18Last September I happened to spend some time in charleston South Carolina it's an old city if you've been there, you know it is a whole place looks like a fire truck and they have a very, very robust fire department.

2:47:32And it may be one of the oldest in the country, but, as I was walking around and the tour guide says, at one time, you only got fire protection if you paid for it, and if you aren't a subscriber.

2:47:46A tough luck there goes your House I don't know what happened, want to jump to the next House but I suppose there was a jurisdictional thing there, but I think.

2:47:55Even charleston came around and the thought that hey it's better if we all pool our money, and we all are covered by police and fire and medical and that's the way it should be an illustrator this this proposal to charge money for medical costs is just ridiculous.

2:48:15The if there's one thing city government is for before, more than anything else it's.

2:48:20public safety, and that is police and fire and medical and I could throw in a few other things too, but those are the top three.

2:48:28And my God you don't nickel and dime people and you don't want to have.

2:48:34Somebody fallen out of a wheelchair, and then the fire department responds with a credit card machine because we're not going to pick you up until you're in the system, oh my God and.

2:48:46I won't even talk about ambulances, because i've dealt with alameda county ambulances, and those people are nasty there are just nasty.

2:48:54And when it comes to building you get one bill and then boom it's off to collection.

2:48:58I don't want to go there, I think Elsa read oh can afford this and if we can't afford it we raise our taxes to pay for it, because public safety is what we're paying for before anything else come on folks that's my opinion.

2:49:15In kill our next speaker is Rosa Escobar rosie should be able to unmute him begin your time now.

2:49:26Rosa esquivel: Thank you, thank you.

2:49:28Fire chief we're gonna need Thank you Council members for staying up so late, my only question is please can you maybe I can delay my time, I just want to understand how this works.

2:49:40So I definitely fires, one thing that I the citizens pay taxes for, but then the the ambulance or the call, I think, as a citizen I don't understand.

2:49:51How that is coming, and how that gets paid so Would you mind explaining to me, are you, I think, in the end is does it make sense that if I if we vote no.

2:50:00i'm paying it out of my taxes, maybe you have to raise taxes anymore, but i'm better off not getting a separate bill is that the end of the day, just.

2:50:07Rosa esquivel: So if we voted yes and pursued this then i'd be getting a bill from the East department every time I mean from the fire department every time I made a phone call for just because yeah just to meet up yeah Thank you if you can I just don't understand how this works, thank you.

2:50:28yeah that concludes our request to speak at this time.

2:50:31Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, cheap, would you like to answer that last question.

2:50:37Michael Pigoni Fire Chief: i'm sure I mean if i'm if I got the exactly what she was asking for is how the billing would work.

2:50:47there's a number of ways that this can that this can work, I mean it can be, it can be more, I mean the easiest way is is that when you call for when you call for a medical dial 911.

2:51:00Is you know fire is going to working through a third building a third party billing company, you will receive an invoice like just very similar to what the ambulance says it won't obviously will not be for the same amount.

2:51:14You know, would be for we'll just say for round numbers, you know $500.

2:51:20And then that would be, but at the same time, if you have insurance it'll automatically get shipped or get mailed or sent to the insurance company, also the copy the way the most of the agencies that I talked with work is.

2:51:35The invoice that the person themselves get is basically a copy of the invoice and it goes right to the insurance, now that differs if you don't have insurance.

2:51:45But then, but again, all of those aspects is what would have to be set up, when we set the program up is exactly how you bill when you build who gets billed.

2:51:56it's just all part of setting the program up.

2:52:00Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: Okay, very good, thank you, I believe we can move on, I just want to thank again chief Michael pagani and appreciate this thorough look at this we've been asking for this for a couple of years and we got it, and so we see all sides of this, and thank you very much.

2:52:24Okay next we will go to city council local and regional leads on assignments.

2:52:31Anyone like to give us an update.

2:52:37got councilmember riding.

2:52:40Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): Thank you mayor.

2:52:42On the recycle more front with the implementation of 1383 one of the elements to the bill is.

2:52:51diverting edible or food edible food recovery is the term so that means that food that could be repurposed and given to a food bank or equivalent so that we have pathways for.

2:53:05for producers to be able to then give this food away so we just awarded a contract through a competitive bid to a vendor that's going to be our up consulting group that's going to be helping.

2:53:22are helping with this element of 1383 implementation, so this is what the city of El cerrito is going to be relying upon so well, we best manage our own recycling program when it comes to this 1383 public.

2:53:34Education element of it we're going to be working with consultants to be able to support that.

2:53:41Okay okay.

2:53:43Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: anyone else.

2:53:47mayor pro tem working on.

2:53:49Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: And I just have a question for Council member renee is part of.

2:53:54When when can we get the or is there any funding or support for trying to have bring your own container or you know.

2:54:05system for our local restaurants.

2:54:08Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): that's a great idea it's not a part of 1383.

2:54:12One of the things that we did approve our little compost pales into big big group of purchase order of compost piles, but when it comes to individual folks or restaurants and reusable containers it's not a part of it.

2:54:26Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: has to I know it on on the peninsula they're doing that program there so.

2:54:32Councilmember Rudnick (she/her): that's I yeah that's it would be great to look into that because certainly reducing food waste include packaging waste as much.

2:54:39Karen Pinkos (City Manager): as possible is important we have we have actually we had provided many years ago we had provided to go to containers, so I can check in with.

2:54:50With staff that may have been grant funded, but we can take a look at that, to see what we did in the past, and if that's available for the future, I still have my.

2:55:01Mayor Pro Tem Motoyama she/her: Great Thank you.

2:55:03Mayor Gabe Quinto - El Cerrito: All right, anyone else.

2:55:06I wanted to report that.

2:55:09Next week i'll be flown off to DC to meet with our Bay area Congressional.

2:55:19Caucus and and i'll be wearing my MC hat and we're flying up on Monday and we'll be back on Wednesday so but i'll be joining.

2:55:32Some folks from MC and i'll be joining mayor pro tem Murphy from panel, so we will look forward to being at Capitol Hill and hopefully speaking with.

2:55:49Someone from Department of Energy and transportation so that's my update, so our next regularly scheduled Council meeting will be on Tuesday may 3 at 7pm so have a good night everybody good night.