City Council Meeting November 20, 2012

0:00:03thank you very much for coming tonight I'd like to call the November 20th 2012 regular city council meeting to order like the records to reflect that all members of the city council with the exception of council member Chang is here and ready to do the city's business

0:00:24uh if you could join me in the pledge pledge allegiance to the flag of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all also like to mention that our city manager tonight Scott Hannan is on the East Coast an emergency medical

0:00:57emergency and assuming that role and responsibility tonight will be the assistant city manager Karen pinkos okay do we have any staff communication Council communication I have several things one is an amazing ly happy honor I attended the sustainable California I mean excuse me

0:01:27sustainable Contra Costa ceremony and we got the I guess you might say the grand prize for our recycling center and they didn't call it a grand prize but it was the highlight of the evening it would appear and so we got this award for our Recycling and environmental

0:01:50Resource Center which is another thing that we can hang on the wall uh to commemorate all of the hard work that went into that project and all of the effort and so we also received some awards that night from the three Contra costs excuse me three Contra Costa members of the state legislature who are

0:02:16Joan Buchanan Susan Bania and our own Nancy Skinner and also a state Senator Mark desangier and also Congressman George Miller uh who just became our Congress members so we have all of these Awards and um for that very um exciting project that we did up at the recycling center replacing it and

0:02:44really bringing recycling operations uh for an on-site facility to a new high and so I'm hoping that I can give all of these things to our staff and I I know they're here I just saw them yay [Applause] thank you Janet okay um I did a I guess this was the period

0:04:14for me to do ceremonial activities so I thought perhaps I ought to mention them because um I appeared on television a couple times so one of the things that happened is on um the in um on October 19th we did the groundbreaking sort of the sort of groundbreaking for the integrated

0:04:37Corridor Mobility project it was held in Emeryville and because it's a technology project and it's not a matter of turning dirt so usually when they do a groundbreaking you use shovels and if necessary somebody brings in a pile of dirt so you can do that and seeing

0:04:57everybody can shovel up the dirt and all that but this is technology so instead of the dirt and the shovels we had electrical cords that we plugged in uh to signify that you can in fact reduce traffic congestion without putting in a lot of lengths of of a highway so um that project is now

0:05:22underway and because it's not moving all that dirt it'll also be done very quickly and it will be up and running completely I think within the next couple of years and so as you see the changes please know that um you'll see signs for example that that talk about getting on and off the

0:05:44freeway there'll be ramp metering that will be programmable in a way that the old style ramp metering wasn't so for example buses get a free ride and when they are on the ramp so that they can get to San Francisco quickly and um if there's a lot of congestion on the

0:06:07ramp then everybody gets through green light so it'll be smart technology it will not be the old style stuff so I think you'll really enjoy it and I especially think that you'll enjoy uh the reduction in congestion um and um just for your information about half of the congestion that occurs

0:06:29occurs because of incidents on the freeway an incident can be an accident it can be a car broke down or whatever but anyway this is designed the system is designed to move people around all of those incidents and then get back get them back on the freeway off San Pablo

0:06:51Avenue when they've gotten beyond the incident so I think you'll appreciate it and every single jurisdiction in the area which goes from the carquinas bridge to the Bay Bridge separately signed on to this system so there's a lot of buy-in and so that's that project and I also

0:07:15um did as in my role as at the Contra Costa Transportation Authority did the groundbreaking for the Lone Tree um segment and E Bart um that's occurring in eastern Contra Costa County so that one does move dirt but it also puts an e-bart which is the BART extension which will be using

0:07:40different technology that is occurring in eastern Contra Costa County and was part of our major J that we passed a while back so those are my uh other items great thank you I just have one item to make note of and that is to thank the arts and culture commission and Suzanne Ayala who staffs

0:08:02that commission for the event they put on on October 26th right out in front of City Hall where they unveiled the city's first public art installation project uh you will be seeing all of these there will be 12 installed along San Pablo Avenue through about the spring of next

0:08:20year so we had a really great party a nice showing and it was a good moment for the commission and all the work they've done I think it was over maybe a 18 month or two year period to get that done so much appreciated to the commission and to Suzanne Runner um I just had one thing I uh attended uh

0:08:47an update meeting I guess is the best way of putting it with uh East Bay municipal's utility district council member Abelson was there and I think I saw Al Miller was also there in his role was stage but uh the thing that impressed me was how East Bay Municipal

0:09:08Utilities District has prepared itself over the years for the safety of our water supply the storage to get through droughts such as last year and one key thing is they brought up over and over again that they were one of their primary jobs is to protect the rate payer in

0:09:31their district and so with that if you're interested and want to find out what the municipal district has been up to and some of these great improvements they've made you can check them out on the website or call our representative Andrew Katz and I know they would be

0:09:50happy to fill you in on that but it is uh I think I found it very not only very informative but very impressive of what they've done to take us into or is it their their goal is 2020 2040.

0:10:07well it's it's one of those to take us into the future and it's great all right with that uh yes thank you your honor um as you know I'm Karen hinkus assistant city manager I just wanted to update you a little bit on the Strategic plan and let you and the public know

0:10:24that we are unveiling a new online tool to gather some additional information if the public wants to go to El Cerrito strategic plan one word dot org we have a new tool called Community voice what we have done with this is that we came up with a lot of the public staff

0:10:43Council came up with a lot of different kind of broad ideas through the first phase of the strategic planning process and so we wanted to come up with a tool to kind of drill down those ideas you know someone might say that economic development is important but what about

0:10:58Economic Development does the public feel as important and what kind of priorities might they be you know thinking about when it comes to that broad topic so this tool will be a lot will allow people to voice some ideas it will allow people to other people to comment on them to vote them up or down

0:11:14so it's kind of a fun new tool that we're that we're testing and we've tested and we're trying for the first time so please check out Community voice on the Strategic plan website and we hope that people like it and we hear from a lot of a lot of you out there on

0:11:28your ideas for the Strategic plan and going forward we'll be sending out information and bringing you additional information for um an upcoming city council Workshop to refine the vision and the values and that'll be sometime in January where we've we're working on making sure we we

0:11:44solidify the date with all of you and you will um we'll make sure that we let everyone know the date when it's finalized so thank you great thank you any other comments okay uh next item please next item is oral Communications from the public and we have one speaker slip Al Miller

0:12:12[address removed] good evening mayor council members before I start my talk I would like to add one thing about the East Bay mud uh you were talking either clean water stage is interested more in their Wastewater or as the trade says the dirty water side what struck me as most impressive is

0:12:34that East Bay mud is the first wastewater treatment plant in the United States of America that generates more electricity in the wastewater treatment process than is used now what that means to us as customers is that PG e is buying electricity from East Bay mud which

0:12:56means pgne is helping us pay our wastewater treatment rates and I think that's a pretty good deal now on Christmas day in 1937 the Cerrito theater opened its doors and started serving the community as a source of entertainment and as part of a source of community

0:13:18the film they showed was thin ice starring the then world famous Olympic female ice skater Sonia Henny on December 13th of this year the Francis Cerrito theater and the Rialto Cinemas are co-sponsoring their 75th anniversary celebration might be too strong a word

0:13:42acknowledgment of the 75th anniversary of the theater on the classics night the classics at the Cerrito is an event co-sponsored by the friends and Rialto Cinemas they have one a month usually the movie that will be shown that night December 13th is you can't take it with

0:14:02you uh starring Gene Arthur and Lionel Barrymore and several others oh James Stewart as a Young Man uh people are interested in coming the tickets are eight dollars in anticipation of a larger attendance it'll be in the downstairs theater rather than the upstairs theater uh

0:14:24suggest you get your tickets early because they've been selling out recently so I wanted to let everybody know and invite everybody in that can come thank you thank you and the other speakers no other speaker slips these speakers would like to uh okay good seeing none we'll move on

0:14:43next.gen item please next agenda item is presentations 4A tahia Day School Proclamation great and I think council member Abelson is going to be making this presentation I'm quite happy to be doing this um um El Cerrito is home to a number of public schools but it's also home

0:15:06to I think even larger number of private schools and what makes up our community is the ability of all of these schools to contribute to to our city environment and we've as a city and tahia day school as a school have received an honor and I'm just sort of saying it's El Cerrito

0:15:28but really they received this honor but it I think does show an honor for all of us and they were selected as um uh one of 269 National Blue Ribbon Schools in the United States that's and they were one of 50 private schools and at the same time there were I think 219 Public

0:15:54Schools selected and this was for academic performance so we received a um or they received a plaque and or will be excuse me let me start over here we are giving them a black uh recognized right right recognizing this honor which is an amazing honor um because if you think about

0:16:20um you know the environment that we are in and the fact that people are what I would call average normal people but they're working really hard and concentrating on the things that put together a quality education in our city and so I'm very very proud to be Associated as the city

0:16:44council member with this school tahia day school and so I would like to ask everyone to and there's some people here I believe from Tahir right great and if you could come up and we'll do the same thing in everybody else and I'll be a little more quiet [Music] for the city Twitter answers

0:17:38yeah you want me to come inside sure wherever you're going to come here um I just wanted to say uh my name is Betty James I'm head of Tokyo day school and this is my board president Debbie bamberger and I wanted to just say how proud We Are to be part of El Cerrito

0:18:05it's been the most amazing Community around us supporting us with us the police have been helpful and we are very proud to bring this award to the city of El Cerrito so thank you on behalf of the school of all the students 246 students 50 staff many many parents we are so

0:18:22thankful to get this award we went last week I went last week to Washington and we were presented with the blue ribbon award by Arnie Duncan and um we were we were very excited we were the only Jewish Day School in the whole of the United States to get it so we are very

0:18:38excited and thanks once again thank you thank you [Applause] for those of you who haven't seen the proclamation it also points out that tahia is the only private school in Northern California to be selected for this honor and only one of two in the state of California so thank you very

0:19:02much it was a great honor thank you foreign next gender item please oh um there's food bank here oh okay uh next agenda item so um the mayor has reordered the presentation calendar and next up is the Contra Costa Solano County Food Bank presentation by David Kiefer who is a

0:19:28food bank ambassador hello council members and citizens of El Cerrito I'm David Kiefer and I've been a resident of El Cerrito for a few years the mission of the food bank of Contra Costa and Solano is simple we bring food to those who are hungry we currently serve 132

0:19:57000 clients per month in Contra Costa and Solano the dictionary has one definition of a bank as a place for storage or a supply or stock for emergency use I am here tonight to show you how our local food bank is organized so that it brings food to those who need it

0:20:19people always ask me where is the food bank well the physical location is in Concord on the north side of highway 4.

0:20:29you see the Drive-In Flea Market on the south side we also have a warehouse cold storage facility in Hayward and Fairfield excuse me these two distribution sites allow us to bring in and store food and refrigerate fresh fruits and vegetables so that they can be distributed

0:20:51everyone has seen the red barrels for collection of dry packaged canned foods these barrels are now switching to blue color thank you El Cerrito for your generous support of this program not only has the city embraced not only has the city embraced this program with the continuous

0:21:33availability of the barrel at the recycling center our Merchants have also been willing participants from Del Norte retail Plaza to the El Cerrito Plaza Shopping Area El Cerrito Merchants display the food bank Barrel I must at this point point out that Weight Watchers

0:22:02I'm sorry yeah if you can it's being obstinate I guess um that's the one that I want um must at this point point note that Weight Watchers on the south side of the El Cerrito Plaza has exceptionally committed to food collection and the food bank of Contra Costa and Solano all

0:22:35the food collected is very much appreciated by the recipients you may have noticed the proliferation of retailers today who are not dedicated grocery stores but still sell packaged and canned foods this development has affected the nation's food pantries in their ability to acquire low-cost or

0:22:56no-cost packaged and canned foods Larry Sly the executive director of the food bank has been there from the beginning feels that providing food bank clients with fresh fruit fruits and vegetables should be a priority our new protests protest troop Truck Pro program which

0:23:18will expand to West County in 2013 is one key element here the food bank of Contra Costa and Solano has established relationships with farmers in the eastern part of Contra Costa County and the Northern California region produce is usually purchased but at a low cost

0:23:37per pound I know that many clients we serve have to travel three four and five miles to reach a store with produce even if their budget allows for such a purchase getting back to the bank concept what the food bank takes in it also distributes the food bank of Contra

0:23:59Costa and Solano has the ability to bring food to the people we have the trucks to reach the neighborhoods where there is need one of the primary methods to get food to these in general or specific age groups distributions we truck the food to a public city-run park or Community

0:24:23Center or County agency another way to provide food assistance is through an agency an agency can be an established charitable concern which recognizes hunger as a challenge facing its constituency a lot of food baskets or meals are distributed through the charitable arm

0:24:48of a religious or community-based organization as an example Richmond has long had grip g-r-i-p Greater Richmond Interfaith program a group of concerned religious leaders and congregants grip is a food bank agency the well-known Bay Area Rescue Mission would be another agency

0:25:15Saint Jerome's see if we can get it to move here Saint Jerome's here in El Cerrito um operates a food pantry which the food bank supplies here is an example of a a of the food bank helping a local agency right here in El Cerrito with our refrigerated trucks and

0:25:44warehouses the food bank of Contra Costa and Solano brings food to people where they need it those religious organizations that have set a priority to eliminate hunger probably would not have the resources to transport the food by themselves even though the conquer

0:26:03the Concord facility uses solar generated power and our trucks are the latest model low emission fuel-efficient engines the food bank is not immune to Rising energy costs those of you that are able to make a financial contribution are true Partners in the war against hunger

0:26:24all the work involved with packing and distributing the food is volunteer labor and I am one of the volunteers if you want to help or better yet if you are affiliated with a group that would like to help I have brought cards with that information with me I was at an event in the Concord

0:26:44facility when a boy scout troop leader whom was there with his Scouts told me that he was so impressed with what the food bank does that he switched his employer-based matched contrib charitable contribution to this cause the food bank also asks those who are concerned to Advocate you may have seen

0:27:06a food bank volunteer wearing a t-shirt that says one in six Americans are hungry recent George Gallup research shows that one in five U.S residents report that they have experienced at least one week within a three-month period where they did not have enough food to eat for the identified client

0:27:26the food bank will go to bat on their behalf our staff includes CalFresh formerly food stamps experts who can help navigate the county bureaucratic system in West County the food for children one of the age-specific food assistance programs mentioned earlier holds a distribution in front of the

0:27:48women's infants and children's office in Contra Costa County we have seen a big increase in the need from 2005 time frame lately there has been a leveling off so we hope that with your support we can make strides to eliminate hunger I want to again thank you for your past

0:28:09support I know that most El Cerrito residents are aware of the need I have brought with me fact cards with contact information for those who wish to volunteer I also have envelopes for those who wish to contribute financially I greatly appreciate the fact that the

0:28:28El Cerrito city council has allowed me to make this presentation this evening thank you thank you appreciate all the work you're doing can I ask one question why are you changing the colors from red to blue possibly to distinguish most people Don are set up by counties so why they while

0:28:55they operate somewhat the same the Alameda County is a different organization you know and I think that's the reason why they're doing it oh good okay well thank you appreciate it okay next agenda item please next agenda item 4B icma Community sustainability Awards

0:29:29good evening I'm Marcia Raines I'm here with my colleague Pat Martell I'm the city manager of the city of Millbrae and I'm representing icma Awards committee icma's International City Managers Association we're here this evening because your city won a very uh prestigious award at our recent

0:29:49International Conference that was conducted in Phoenix Pat is a former member of the icma board she will tell you which city she's with but we wanted to come here this evening and make sure that the community the mayor the council and the staff for El Cerrito understood the significance

0:30:06of this very prestigious award so we're very happy to be here tonight I have for the city this beautiful award and it's on behalf of icma awarding to the city of El Cerrito a program Excellence award these are very difficult to come by you compete nationally internationally for these and

0:30:25it's on behalf of community sustainability for your San Pablo San Pablo Avenue streetscape project in addition to the award that I will leave with your clerk I have an identification the program that was presented at the Phoenix conference just over a month ago that identifies the

0:30:43other awards that were one achieved by cities in other categories but your category is community sustainability and I wanted to be here in person to congratulate you as a community for the nice work that you do and the high level performance of your staff your fine

0:30:59staff now my colleague Pat Martel is going to identify herself and then give the individuals involved in this program the awards that were awarded on an individualized basis Pat thank you very much Marcia good evening thank you for the opportunity to be here representing icma my name is Pat Martell

0:31:16I'm the city manager of Daly City I am a former member of the icma board I had the great privilege of serving on the icma board with your assistant city manager Karen pinkos and I have to tell you not only are you very honored to receive this award I think you were

0:31:34spectacularly represented as a city and the state of California was as well with Karen's participation as a member of the icma board she great brought great diligence to her profession and to this city and I I wanted to really emphasize that because I found it uh really an extraordinary

0:31:54professional opportunity to work with Karen on the icma board but as Marcia mentioned at the Phoenix conference we did present uh Awards to a number of communities across the country it is as Marcia said a stellar opportunity for a community to be recognized by the

0:32:15international City County management association because there are hundreds and hundreds of applicants for each of the various categories of awards each year and the San Pablo streetscape project was identified as an outstanding representation of community partnering

0:32:35and solving a number of sustainability issues marsh and I as we were driving here albeit a bit a bit late because of the rain had the opportunity to actually drive along San Pablo Avenue so we've seen firsthand what an extraordinary job the city of El Cerrito has done and in

0:32:52particular your staff who are involved in coordinating all the efforts of the various Community Partners and leveraging the funds that were necessary to realize this Project's accomplishments your city hall is absolutely beautiful and you should all be very very proud of of the efforts

0:33:09that use the city and your Community Partners and residents of the community are benefiting from those efforts so on behalf of icma I am proud to be able to present to Karen pinkos your assistant city manager and award if you want to come up Karen and it is in recognition of the San

0:33:29Pablo Avenue streetscape project congratulations [Applause] all right we also have an award for your environmental services division manager Melanie Mintz [Applause] we understand that Scott is not here this evening but we also have a plan we do have a um I would like to

0:34:25leave the mayor and council members and again congratulations well thank you I really appreciate you spending your evening you're both city managers I know you're out of town I mean out at night quite a bit in your own City so I'd like to thank you and I know the traffic jam you went through it

0:34:45was uh real bad earlier in the day so thank you for putting up with that and coming into our city and presenting us with these prestigious Awards thank you very much okay oh okay thank you my pleasure thank you congratulations any other Awards tonight well thank you it's been a nice first

0:36:19part of the meeting and we appreciate everybody coming out for that uh okay uh could we go with the next agenda item please the next agenda item is the consent calendar items a through G I move adoption of consent calendar items 5A through 5G um May I read into uh that motion the

0:36:41title of 5G which is an ordinance of the city council of the city of El Cerrito amending El Cerrito Municipal Code section 2.04.300 Financial Advisory Board in my second would you accept that I accept that thank you okay I've been moved and seconded all those in favor

0:37:05aye aye opposed motion carries thank you and I think we kept our City attorney happy with that internet sometimes we do a little have to do some technical things and one of them was that we had to read the title of the the ordinance into the record before we could actually accept it so that's why

0:37:26there was a little little difference in the uh consent calendar tonight so thank you next item please next item 7A Solid Waste rate and operational review report and extension of the garbage and Greenways collection franchise agreement with the East Bay sanitary company

0:37:43we have a staff report thank you good evening honorable mayor council members community my name is Garth Schultz I'm an environmental analyst in the Environmental Services Division division here in the city of El Cerrito and among other duties I'm in charge of your

0:38:04recycling programs and I manage the franchise agreement with your Solid Waste hauler East Bay sanitary company I'm here tonight to present the results of the rate and operations review that was initially entered into back in July 2011 and also to give some details about

0:38:24a request for an extension to the franchise agreement with me here tonight are our Consultants our three Consulting Group represented by William Schoen here in the back and also representatives from East Bay sanitary Company Mark vergoni and Vicki fagoney I think it's not happy

0:38:49okay thank you thank you thanks Melanie we can go to the next one okay so East Bay sanitary company a little background overall in terms of where we're at is the franchise taller for garbage and green waste in El Cerrito and has been since 1941. the agreement's been amended a few times

0:39:09most recently to get the agreement to um an extension to 2018 into the current agreement ends December 31st 2018.

0:39:20recently we've proposed an adjustment to the rates to the council this was back in 2011 to adjust for the issue of migration and migration is Loosely when folks move their garbage container sizes from larger container sizes down to smaller container sizes which because we

0:39:38have a pay to throw system for garbage here in El Cerrito results in less cost to the cons customer it's a beneficial use in terms of the fact that it helps incentivize folks to throw less material into the garbage can and results in less material going to landfills but it's also caused some

0:39:54Revenue problems for the company and this is not just local here but all throughout the Bay Area and it's something that in 2011 in terms of making an adjustment for the company we also sought direction to pursue an Avenue to correct for this moving forward into the future so per the

0:40:10council's direction we contracted with our three Consulting Group to perform a rate and operations review of the company which I'll detail in a moment the review was substantially completed in December 2011 and we were awaiting a response from a space sanitary company

0:40:24on several of the recommendations and items of the report um and as a result The Collection rates for East Bay sanitary company did not change in 2012. in fact the 2012 rates for all commercial customers the total amount they pay on their bill was flat between 2011 and 2012 so there's been no

0:40:42increase to those rates since January 1st 2011.

0:40:47in May of 2012 the company proposed extending their franchise agreement through December 31st 2013 in response to the city's requests for greater efficiencies and more services as a result of the operations review thank you on the operations review the objectives

0:41:07were to determine a revised rate for a space sanitary effective 2012 on January 1st 2012. to establish a rate methodology that would mitigate for the migration problem I detailed to review and identify potential efficiencies for the company and to review service

0:41:24changes I'm going to perform a few other analyzes of the company's performance overall and to look at our own recycling collection operation and identify opportunities for increased efficiency on our side in brief the results were as such these Bay sanitary has made several

0:41:42incremental changes to their processes over the course the last few years that helped to maximize efficiency on the routes and have also demonstrated that they're efficient in their safety customer service billing and Etc they operate their routes and customer service in the safe and effective and

0:41:57efficient manner some of the expenses the East Bay Company was charging to the rates we've disallowed as a result of the rate review and one thing that was important and came up was that there's potential for the company to incorporate some maintenance of the city's recycling

0:42:12Fleet into their own maintenance operation to provide for greater safety and effective effectiveness of our own vehicles and result in some rate savings to the ratepayers the final result of the rate review was recommending a 0.81 increase to the collection rates in 2012 which again did

0:42:28not happen in May 2012 when East Bay Sand provided their response to the review they included a proposal to extend the agreement to achieve some cost savings and some greater services when staff receive this we recognize that there was a potential for cost savings there we saw that there was a

0:42:49potential for increased service and we saw that there was more rate stability that was being posed as a possible outcome of an extension so we decided to to study it and further sorry turn in my head um just to see if there would be adequate benefits resulting from an

0:43:04extension so we met in good faith to see if we could get those leverage and result in adequate benefits as a result there was some negotiated terms that we believe would establish a greater level of partnership between the company and the city and incentivize greater waste diversion which is

0:43:21obviously one of the things that we want to continue to strive for in brief on this slide and I'll highlight a few other details one main item that came as a result of the extension negotiations and discussions was the company agreeing to decrease their profit ratio they are a

0:43:41private company and they do make a profit on their business but they're proposing to to reduce that ratio into it effectively is sixty thousand dollars less to the company per year another item is frozen officer salaries for 2013 which is about eighteen thousand dollars in

0:43:58Savings in this rate coming right here longer amortization for trucks and Equipment over a longer term of the agreement resulting in roughly 77 000 in savings I mentioned the truck maintenance on the recycling Fleet as well as some other recycling services that support the ongoing operations of

0:44:15the recycling center as well as the Corporation Yard estimated at around twenty five thousand dollars a year and then we get into some of the customer service functions they've agreed to in the draft terms have longer customer service hours establish a functioning website with bill payment

0:44:32options um provide customer service and recycling training to all of their employees on an annual basis and to designate a commercial account representative who among other things would be visiting 120 businesses per year in the city that's restaurants other businesses

0:44:49multi-family complexes in order to do an in-depth diversion Audits and work to get those businesses towards greater diversion and less waste going to landfills a few other services are called out in the details of the report and the details of the proposed amendment to the

0:45:07franchise agreement um among them increased on-call Services those are free services to El Cerrito residents at their curb that they can call on for a year which would include electronics and an additional on-call pickup for green waste is a few and a few other curbside services that support

0:45:24the recycling operations and finally there's a proposed increase to the franchise fee which would raise the franchise fee from 10 to 12 percent which is a roughly 100 000 a year um increase in general fund revenues in considering the proposed extension staff and R3 Consulting we had to weigh

0:45:48the benefits and costs of extending an agreement Now versus bidding an agreement out in 2018 which is when the current agreement terminates one of the most important things that we needed to look at was where do East Bay sanitaries rates stand now vis-a-vis our

0:46:04region and we determined among other things that they are in line with regional rates with one important qualifier is that we have an incomparable service here that are on the total Solid Waste rates now and that's our recycling center in our analysis we we did account for the fact

0:46:19that we have a recycling center that is unlike anyone else or any other city in our region and when we account for that we find that about 30 percent of the customer base now pays about four dollars or less on average than than the region and those are the folks in the 20

0:46:36gallon container we have a very high proportion of our community on the smallest mini can size about 65 percent of our residential population uses a 35 gallon Canadian container and they pay roughly just less than a dollar more on average um than the other folks in our region

0:46:54another important comparison and this is a recent changes the city of albany's rates even uh rate for rate including the recycling center costs within our own rate base they pay on average slightly higher per resident their rates have gone up tremendously in the last

0:47:10couple of years in order to bring their services to a higher standard level of expectations and so as they exist now our rights are pretty much on par with Albanese another important consideration that we assessed was that per the proposed length of extension the

0:47:30the agreement would terminate at the end of 2025 which is coterminous with the franchises held by our other member agencies in West County including Richmond San Pablo Pinole and Hercules they all have a contract with Richmond Sanitary Service that ends in the end of

0:47:452025 and if ours if there is an interest among the city council in the future to bid out these Services we feel it's more likely to get greater service change service increases or greater you know benefits in terms of the cost to the ratepayer by going as a region as

0:48:02opposed to going it alone just El Cerrito one other item we identified in terms of just looking at what the costs or risks might be is that in the short term extending the agreement avoids some risks of changing a service provider it avoids some cost of going out to bid and

0:48:19we've seen that some other cities in our region have done this recently including Albany Clayton Martinez and Pittsburgh and they've extended for similar reasons than we're stating there's a couple different considerations that I'd like to highlight I've mentioned a few times and I just

0:48:36think this is important to remember is that there wasn't any change in the residential rate based in 2012 so from a financial consideration rates that we're going to see and hopefully propose to the Council next month take into account that there was flat rates for a year

0:48:53by granting an extension we're modeling that the rate adjustment for the coming 2013 year would be about two percent less than it would be otherwise we don't we're not firm on all those details right now but the in the draft agreement that's in front of you is an increase to the company's Revenue

0:49:10requirement that's less than five percent I think it's 4.79 and that will be translated into the rates if the extension is approved if the extension weren't approved we would we're modeling that would be at least two percent higher than that possibly a little bit

0:49:26more we haven't fully negotiated what that would look like one other thing we've looked at closely and this is partially because of some of the terms that come up in having a longer agreement and some of the other terms such as a balancing account which levelizes for fluctuations in revenue

0:49:41and expenses over time is a balancing account that would provide for greater rate stability into the future I mentioned some of the other Financial benefits in terms of the additional general fund revenue and the additional revenues to support some of the recycling functions that are currently

0:49:57paid through the Integrated Waste Management fees there's also some environmental considerations I think most importantly is right now the way it stands with the company is that there's a disincentive to reduce the amount of waste going to landfill because it directly impacts their

0:50:10revenue this agreement reduces many of those barriers to a partnership that would reduce that waste into the landfill incentivizes diversion and ultimately helps us reduce our greenhouse gas impacts as a community it also requires so much more involvement on the company's part in

0:50:28terms of participation and Recycling and I for one I'm looking forward to working with them in more detail on that so in summary and I have one item to a couple items to note before I get to your questions we see lower more stable rates as a result of an extension less landfilled

0:50:46waste more Recycling and composting significant more customer services and a fair amount of value to the city I do want to highlight I did receive some questions from council members benicini and council member Lyman that we were able to answer one in particular

0:51:01is um an important change that we have worked out today uh to the final page of the proposed amendment which is in section 23q and we would like to change that language and I believe Scott Woodruff is going to introduce that language for the council thank you go for it so

0:51:36um the I believe the the changed wording was just distributed to the council this primarily relates to the manner of calculation of a component of the rate formula and I can certainly read it for you but I can also just give the city council an opportunity to review it

0:51:59before um before you move on in case you have additional questions about it thank you it's very long which is why I hesitated to read it but I think you've all had an opportunity to review it now and we can either take questions I can read it into the record if that's helpful but I

0:53:10believe that that ultimately the council having had a chance to review it if your ultimate decision is to approve this amendment to the agreement that you would want the motion to include the revised section 23q that was presented to you just now or with any changes that you have all right

0:53:28um for the sake of transparency I would like you to read it so that the public has heard it and it's out in the public View and and going along with the concept of transparency I would like to make sure that the uh franchise Mr fragoni has has had an opportunity to

0:53:45review it and has also concurred with the change as well and he in his uh counterpart um have both been able to review that prior to the start of the meeting and I'll let them make a statement if they wish let's add it right into the record first so thank you okay so

0:54:02um this is set revised section 23q I'm just going to go ahead and read through it rather than try to identify the the specific change terms because it's rather heavily edited so forgive me um for for taking a fair amount of time to do this but here we go the city agrees that when rates are

0:54:22calculated the rate share of the company's then unfunded pension liability will be 78.5 percent pending managerial review of the pension fund and investment strategy the company agrees that the annual rate review share of the company's then unfunded pension liability shall not exceed forty five

0:54:40thousand eight hundred eighty five dollars per year until a time when the pension becomes fully funded upon full funding of the pension the amount will be removed from the rate base if the rate base share 78.5 percent of the annual pension liability contribution

0:54:56exceeds or does not meet forty five thousand eight hundred eighty five dollars then the amount owed or saved that year shall be debited or credited against the balancing account if at the end of the franchise term or in the event of an assignment transfer or sale which is going to be defined for

0:55:14this section only as termination the company's pension is not fully funded then the company shall continue to be compensated via the rate base the 78.5 percent rate base share of the unfunded pension liability amount that existed at the time of termination until the

0:55:31earlier of the company's pension liability being fully funded for five or excuse me being fully funded or five years of the date of termination in the event of termination the company the city and the assignee or purchaser of the company May negotiate a separate

0:55:46arrangement for compensating the company for any amount of its pension liability that remains unfunded at the time of termination including but not limited to negotiating the amount of unfunded pension liability that will be included in the rate base and that concludes the

0:56:00that section okay thank you um two two points of clarity the um requirement that the original queue did have a five-year clause in it as well so this is not introducing a new five-year Clause so that so even though the editing looks like it's introducing a five-year closet it it's not that that

0:56:22five years past the point of termination was in the previous version um and then the other thing that I want to make sure is clear this is the version of termination that is discussed in section three of the um Amendment but section five of the parent contract so page two of twelve

0:56:52um where it's uh section 5G of the original agreement which says that if there's this unauthorized sale the agreement terminates and that's that's the definition of term of sale that this one's referring to is that correct the because we were combining actually

0:57:12um I I think it's slightly different because this section 23q has several combined terms in it that could result in the transition um to a new operator and that is either um uh excuse me just make sure I've got all this card it could be either the assignment of the contract itself or the

0:57:34transfer or sale of the company I wanted to make I I since I was since the term termination is used in other places in the agreement I specifically included a parenthetical reference that restricted this definition of termination to this section 23q but I want it but I also

0:57:50wanted to make sure because we were combining several terms just for efficiency I wanted to not keep repeating um assignment sale transfer um so just use the term termination so it seemed like the easiest one to use okay thank you thank you so just a further clarification then if

0:58:12the city has a role in approving an assignment or sale of the company is that correct that is correct assignment assignment of the of the agreement which would be done either by a direct assignment or by a purchaser a sale or transfer of the company which would the contract would

0:58:32go with it is subject to reasonable approval by the city Council or city staff city council okay thank you and that's outlined in apparently again going back to that same section um foreign section three but it's contract section five G um which now I'm on the top of page

0:58:55three of twelve this the uh confer on the city the right to terminate the agreement in its entirety without the utilization of the procedures set forth in section 20 of this agreement um section 20 defines the approval process I assume if I may council member Lyman it's actually all of section five

0:59:17we don't have all of the sections or all of the provisions of section five listed here but it is Section Five that specifically deals with assignment or transfer and then there's other sections that deal with termination section 20 is if the city were to have um identified that the company had not

0:59:35fulfilled the provisions of the agreement then we would be able to proceed with so that's rectifying that so that's the termination section is section 20 then that's the if there's unfulfilled Provisions in the in the uh in the city company's performance then that's how the city would proceed to

0:59:51terminate overall the termination is section three of the agreement which is also listed on page 2 of 12. that's where it really specifies the overall termination date assuming no transfer sale or proceeding to terminate based upon unfulfilled Provisions or performance by the company great um I

1:00:11understand that section 5 I is deleted in its entirety and based on footnotes in the agenda Bill 5 I was the um I believe five I was the one that uh limited the resale to is that correct it's actually all of the sections that are listed here in section five the

1:00:35section 5A 5c 5f 5G and 5i parenthesis five all of those included references limiting the franchise agreement to two years if it were to be sold or transferred that's all of those sections have been amended in or deleted to eliminate the reference to the two-year

1:00:54term the two-year termination of franchise if it's transferred sold or assigned great thank you yes any questions yes I have a couple more questions thank you Mr Schultz good presentation and thank you for helping me with all the questions I had earlier um just to be really clear about we

1:01:14talked a lot about migration at one of our prior meetings um when we talked about rate differences can you talk about this key conclusion you have here lower more stable rates can you just kind of go through where we are today and why that may not be leading to more stable rates and what

1:01:29this agreement will do to ensure that if this were approved through this this time period through 2025 we should be able to see more stable rates great thank you for the question um and I'll address both lower and more stable partially lengthening the term of the agreement helps to amortize greater

1:01:46costs over a longer period of time such that we don't Bear all of those costs in near term so that's one of the main ways of getting towards lower the other in terms of more stable one of the key factors that contributes to that is the establishment of a balancing account and

1:02:00the way this works is if the count Council adopts the or sets the maximum rate the company May charge for collection services in any given year say January 1st 2013 and if over the course of that year there's more business there's more households using more waste and during the course of that

1:02:21year the company over collects Revenue over what had been calculated as their revenue requirement to meet all of their operational expenses plus their profit and other costs that's all established through the the rate review and is included attachments to this agreement

1:02:35if they over collect Revenue then that over collection of Revenue helps to offset the following Year's rates the opposite is also true if for some reason folks continue to migrate further and further downwards from 35 gallon containers to 20 gallon containers or

1:02:51otherwise if there's an a a less than required collection of Revenue than that amount say 25 000 will be captured in the following year's rate adjustment and so rather than saying having the company deal with that over collection or an under collection and dealing with that over the course of

1:03:11several years and then suddenly coming up and saying oh hi our our rates are not set to help us capture what we need in terms of our operational expenses and our profit we need to ask for a significant jump in the rates instead that's captured slowly and continuously

1:03:26over time the important factor here that hasn't been in there before from my opinion is if there is an over collection that helps to offset the following Year's rates and the rate payer shares and that that Surplus value from the migration standpoint it also helps to make sure that if you know if

1:03:42the company is feeling the impacts economically of folks either closing businesses or closing you know vacating homes and there isn't the service subscription base out there to to meet the revenue requirement it helps make sure that the company is whole for the

1:03:59terms of the agreement and keeps them as a collaborator with the city in terms of moving stuff out of the garbage can and into the recycling or green waste container right now if I go to a business out there and say we've got a great food scraps collection program in

1:04:13El Cerrito you're a restaurant we'd sure love to see you put more of your material into the food scraps container right now if they do that and do that well as a business that actually hurts the company's overall bottom line and they do not have incentive to work

1:04:26directly with that business or with us and making sure that those changes are made the establishment of the balancing account removes that that impact from the calculation because the company knows in the following year they'll be able to make up that that net impact to

1:04:41them so you brought up another item that I wanted to hear a little bit more about so when I first got on the council I was in the apartments down the block and I was so excited about the green waste bins you were going to bring and I moved out and there were no

1:04:53Greenway spins um so I I read with interest all of the items so the company wants a greater term and in them wanting something we want to try to get it you know what we would like out of the contract as well so that's one of the things we wrote a lot about in the staff report was having

1:05:08to do with the Outreach they're going to do the commercial businesses so can you talk about what the green what the state of the Greenways program is today in terms of Education to our multi-family apartments or commercial businesses and what we anticipate will happen if this

1:05:22agreement is approved good that I may need to come back to you on the details of that question but the the state currently in terms of reaching out to our commercial Base by which I include all businesses all restaurants and all multifamily dwellings um is that we have a few things going on

1:05:40one is that the state has adopted regulations that require all of the commercial businesses who subscribe to a certain level of waste which is a fair portion here in the city as well as all multi-family dwellings five units and over to recycle in some way shape or

1:05:54form that isn't very clearly defined they can you know just have one bin and they can't they might not be recycling to their fullest capacity but if they're recycling to some degree they make the letter of the law we've been working directly as the city to outreach to all

1:06:08of those businesses and multi-family complexes to make sure they understand the the state mandate but also provide the services to them so that they can reduce the amount going into their blue garbage container and reduce the amount going to landfills we've done that in

1:06:21terms of with the multi-family complex providing direct Outreach to doors doing direct via door hanger which we hit all of the units in the city on a couple of years ago we did direct postcard to all of those entities and both of those items are things that we're looking to repeat

1:06:36in the coming year we also provided bags to the community members in those complexes to help make sure that they get recycling but in multi-family complexes at current it is an extra cost on the rate base for them to be able to subscribe to the green waste program and for them as a an owner

1:06:56or a manager of a multi-family complex they would need to make the decision to opt into a green waste program and potentially can make similar adjustments to their garbage container rates so say they would add in Greenway service reduce their garbage service and it

1:07:09becomes essentially a zero net sum to their pocketbook as well as the companies depending upon the the exact service levels they choose as a as the subscriber but that's a challenging Prospect I mean we haven't been full-fledged into promoting it to multi-family dwellings as of yet we have

1:07:26issued Outreach them encouraging them to do it but I think part of the the in-depth site diversion visits that the company will perform will help Target that starting with the largest complex first to the commercial business side there has been more activity and there

1:07:40is actually right now at the recycle more Regional Authority level consultant working here to help promote food scrap programs to the Food Service businesses in the city but it's still a challenging Prospect we have a lot of work to do they require a lot of hand-holding a lot of on the site direct

1:07:58contacts so I think the the the summary answer to to your question is we've started the process we've been engaging in Outreach to All Of Those portions of the commercial sector but there's still a lot of work to do and I think that this agreement helps us get there

1:08:12because it ensures on the ground face-to-face contact on behalf of the company and then we'll also be doing some as the city to make sure that folks are aware of the services they're aware of the options and can help them do the right thing great okay I might have more

1:08:27questions later but I'd like to stop for now okay thank you I'd like to move on to a follow-up question on the multi-family units um I my daughter just moved into one in El Cerrito and um I found I wasn't really able to adequately tell her what to do and she couldn't figure it out either without a

1:08:51call to to the recycling center but what I wonder about as a as a larger issue Beyond her is that what she did of moving out into a multi-family unit is repeated time and time and time again so even if you do a some sort of an education program at a point in time it doesn't really handle

1:09:16um anyone except the person who happens to be living there at that time and um so I'm wondering if you've thought about any more ongoing way of of dealing with the issue of getting people who live in multi-family units to be part of our system very good question thank you for it we

1:09:36definitely have thought about that and in fact the the details of the previous multi-family dwelling recycling Outreach that we've done on behalf of the city which I should note was funded by the state's Cal recycle program we still have materials to be able to do that and

1:09:51it's in our plans to go and do another application of those bags door hangers and postcards as a part of our Outreach we always try to work on site with the owner or manager or Advocate you know just a resident who's interested in recycling wherever we can encouraging

1:10:08them to have those resources on hand and you know educate their their neighboring units and if they're a manager or owner give those that information to new tenants as they move in so we're there to provide the resources and we do have the means the resources and the intent

1:10:24to continue to to reach out to those you know sectors of the multi-family Community but it is an ongoing process I mean it requires repeated contacts and we have plans to do that but it even then we need on-site Advocates on on property to be able to help carry it through to its maximum

1:10:49so I I have questions right now are okay okay anymore no oh okay no I read the packet well with that thank you very much for the report and I'll open it up for public comment thank you thank you we have any speakers on the issue yes we have one speaker Tom panis

1:11:28good evening mayor Jones members of the council and City staff my name is Tom Patterson I live at [address removed] in El Cerrito this evening we're looking at an area where else has always been a leader diverting Solid Waste one part of the stream we process a so-called green

1:11:41waste I say so-called because I don't think this green material is waste at all in fact I'd say it's closer to treasure than to waste my when I bought my house in 1976 one of the first things I did was put a compost heap that's where all my garden cuttings and materials from the kitchen have gone

1:11:57ever since not in the solid waste stream I character this characterize this as my green stream not as my green waste any members of The Counselor staff would like to see what a compost looks he looks like after more than 30 years you're welcome to stop by my house you

1:12:10might also want to take a look at what's done for my garden yet every so often I find myself scratching my head and asking why is this city penalizing me for doing this I've had to pay to dispose of so-called green waste for a number of years but it's not not a

1:12:24service I care to use the truth and a minor fit a fit of peak a few years ago I ordered a green waste container not because I plan to use it because I paid for it so many times over I suggest that we need to think about imaginatively about this we should be giving people

1:12:38incentives to compost their green stream in their own backyard not penalizing them by forcing them to subsidize Green Waste Service they don't use at least some companies have begun turning this green green stream into compost but that just proves that the green stream is

1:12:52valuable and in fact backyard composting rarely fails to return more compost to its point of origin than does disposing of a site's green of any site's green stream and then buying it back plus we can make quantifiable debt in our carbon footprint if East Bay sanitary had one less green stream truck

1:13:08than I have right now that truck wouldn't have to drive around town burning fossil fuels wouldn't need to haul the green stream to the composting site wouldn't be one more large vehicle in the way of traffic and weighing down our first class streets Melanie Garth and the rest of the

1:13:21environmental services team do a fantastic job what I'm suggesting this evening is not meant to be spatter in any way what they've accomplished but I believe the opportunity to both benefit the community and extend our reputation for innovation with some creative thinking uh is an

1:13:36opportunity here plenty of plenty of issues would come up if we press forward on this to make this work garbage rates would need to go up what better way to get an angry mob to descend on City Hall but plenty of right people thought recycling would never work they were

1:13:50wrong I also certainly understand that East Bay sanitary needs to have a viable business model if they're going to remain a cooperative and valued business partner of our city when I discuss this idea with Mark fagoney he encouraged me to bring the idea to the tension of the

1:14:04city Mark's always looking for ways to better service customers this kind of change can't happen without a number of parties investing a significant time and effort and it'll take a lot of time but it's clear this is a direction our city should want to go and time to start

1:14:17thinking about it thank you for your time this evening oh wait mayor Jones yes I'd like to thank you for your many years of service you're about to step aside here both on the council and on commissions thank you so much and as well Mary Dodge and Jerry Bradshaw who aren't

1:14:33going to be hanging around too much longer I'd really like to thank them for everything they've done well thank you very much appreciate it next uh speaker if any I have no other slips okay anybody else would like to speak on the subject okay scene Mana I'll bring it back to

1:14:50the council for uh discussion and uh who wants to start on this sure I can I can um start on this uh this is um it's a pleasure actually to be taking up an item like this where we're actually getting more services more Revenue and we're creating stable rates for our

1:15:13residents so that this is uh I want to commend staff Garth um Mr Schoen with R3 and and Mr frigoni for your almost over a year 18 months of hard work on this and it really it really shows I really appreciate an item like this which has so much background to it and has been well thought out and

1:15:38and provides our residents with such a so many benefits um well I certainly agree with um what Greg just said I think that um you can really see I was actually when I first got on the council we went through another process and one of the things I thought about as I went through the

1:16:00packet on this is how different uh this is than that presentation that one was kind of a lot more as I remember about numbers it wasn't about new ways of doing business and this one is very much I think about pushing the envelope and trying to figure out better ways to

1:16:21do things and I'm I'm really excited about the opportunity to do that and I um especially want to thank East Bay sanitary for for buying into that concept and I think it really um it looks to me like it's a win-win situation and um it uh you know makes gives us a stable situation for a longer

1:16:47period of time and I'm I think that's a really good thing for our residents and I think also that um the some of the ideas about more customer service um are are really uh interesting to me and um I especially like things such as the idea of um East Bay sanitary doing

1:17:11maintenance and on our own treks that we use for recycling but I think that's you know looking at things in the big picture and sort of seeing how do we put this all together and make it work better for everybody and I think that's a really nice example of that so I want to thank

1:17:29everybody involved that especially whoever it was that actually came up with that idea because I think it's a good one so I think um this looks like a very well thought out proposal and I'm you know ready to move forward on it if I can just make a couple comments I

1:17:50started reading this item and talking over with staff with an extremely skeptical eye my first read of it is always with a little bit of of Suspicion when you're doing something without putting it out to bid but looking at all the benefits this brings to the city I

1:18:04can oh I can say in this case where we have a partner in this negotiation that takes the place of what we normally do in terms of competitive bidding process processes and it and I appreciate all the cost savings that we're going into it with reducing the profit margins

1:18:19increasing the finance the franchise fees working on the recycling trucks so I I was really brought around by this lengthy packet item and with discussions that we had with staff so I was happy when I got all the questions answered and understood it really fully and I'm

1:18:36happy to support it and I'd like to suggest that Mr panis might want to work with our eqc or other members of the staff to start a maybe a backyard composting Workshop where I can imagine that being extremely well attended Hall I certainly would like to know more

1:18:50about it so thank you for your comments Mr panis all right before my comments I'd like to ask if uh East Bay sanitary would like to say a few words or comment sure thank you for the opportunity Mark for going with East Bay sanitary uh the presentation that you've seen as council

1:19:11member Lyman alluded to it's taken quite a long time it's been about 18 months and I would like to extend thanks on behalf of East Bay sanitary to staff for entertaining the conversation to Scott and Melanie and in particular to Garth Garth uh garth's been incredible through

1:19:28this process he's a talented diligent and dedicated and it's been a pleasure working with him uh in terms of the financial aspects going forward we have been at Cross purposes as as over the past several years as we've implemented new programs and tried to divert more and more waste from the

1:19:53waste stream I am looking forward personally and I know my my family my partners are as well in actually becoming this partner that we have outlined in this presentation and actually starting to work with the city and to be aggressive about waste diversion we're very much looking

1:20:08forward to it and on a very personal note uh we've been here since 1941 we had family in the business going back to the turn of the century in Oakland we had a great grandfather it was one of the original founders of Oakland's scavenger company way back when and so uh we for

1:20:24uh currently in the business uh are very proud to be fourth generation garbage men we like to call it and uh I think the city is well served by having a small family company like this when our customers call us they get a person to answer the phone uh and so we're proud

1:20:42with the service that we offer and I just want to thank you for for entertaining this this extension agreement request thank you very much I'd be happy to answer any questions you have of us as well so any questions we'll let you off the hook I guess huh thanks a lot

1:21:00well my uh comments I guess uh is more maybe more of a recap than trying to convince uh people one way or the other it sounds pretty good but uh I'd just like to kind of recap uh review some of the things that were said and how we got into this uh it was true 18 months ago

1:21:21when the rates came up the council did ask the staff to review and evaluate situation and I think it was because we recognized that this is just not another rate review and who's going to pay for what and what's going to pay for who the industry itself is going through a

1:21:46change in transition and trying to find the proper role and way to achieve things in the future and so uh we did ask staff to review evaluate not only the current agreement but use a third party uh that is in in the business itself to help us evaluate where we're heading into the future as

1:22:10well as the agreement and what what came out of it was a partnership that we're talking about and instead of being at the table one side and the other and taking out the two by fours and and trying to convince the other party that we're right and they're wrong we work together on this

1:22:32and that was probably the most satisfying part of the whole Venture here and uh in my opinion though the overriding consideration and concern for the council is to remember that waste collection is a is critical in maintaining the basic Public Health and Welfare

1:22:54standards for the community that's the way it got started and that's the reason why we spend so much time money on it it is a basic public health issue and our contract must provide services that are effective and efficient and have the ability to be flexible to meet

1:23:14this objective and I think it does in a very uh forthright manner like I said the the industry is changing and even faster than it was even projected four or five years ago it's it's amazing I had the pleasure of representing El Cerrito on the West Contra Costa Integrated Waste Management

1:23:35Authority for several years and it's the same seat that mayor Pro Tim Lyman now occupies and it has allowed me to have insight to the regional and National move in a direction and what's interesting it doesn't matter if you're talking El Cerrito California or Newark

1:23:54New Jersey they're going through the same type of issues and same type of wondering how we're going to go forward and what is the model for that uh it's it's interesting because what triggered this was after many years of recycling and promoting recycling suddenly there's an increase in

1:24:18recycling services and collectibles and a decrease in the landfill and this really did predicate things like a rate methodology review and what is responsible and reasonable rates and what is fair and reasonable profit and probably the biggest question and we're

1:24:39trying to answer it or at least beginning to try to answer it tonight is what is the best way to deliver the future services it's a critical time in deciding the future of the of waste collection for those reasons and we're here to try to do that for the residents and businesses

1:24:55of El Cerrito but it can also be a beneficial time to formulate a plan in place now in order to go forward right away I'm satisfied that the core elements of the service meets the present and future needs of waste collection services and this exists with the current vendor

1:25:18and they have demonstrated that working with the city they can provide expanded Services comparable rates to other jurisdictions provides savings for the city be able to secure the required capital outlay and make a fair profit by extending the contract uh on a personal note though I really

1:25:41believe that it it is in our best interest to go forward with a trusted partner that we've had since 1941.

1:25:49um it provides unique advantages that may not be present in 2018 and or with a new company they know the city we communicate and work on a collaborative manner on many of the issues of mutual interest their infrastructure and service systems are in place and will improve almost

1:26:09immediately with this extension and best of all they are a small locally owned Independent Business they're not a big conglomerate and if you have read anything on the industry you know that waste collection is being controlled by and controlled more and more by the big Industries and

1:26:33corporations in the Waste Management Field so uh and most of all I think most important I I base my opinion on the throne independent professional study and evaluation that not only suggests but actually verifies that the residents and businesses of El Cerrito should expect to realize the benefits

1:26:53described in the report mentioned tonight so I would again like to join my colleagues in endorsing this agreement and begin the process of developing our way that we're going to um collect waste for the future so with that I'd entertain a motion can I move a resolution of the city council

1:27:17of the city of El Cerrito extending the garbage and green waste collection franchise agreement with East Bay sanitary Company Incorporated by seven years by a Fifth Amendment to the franchise agreement including the revised measure uh 23q section 23q that was read into the

1:27:39record by the City attorney second the motion it's been moved a second on the motion all those in favor aye aye opposed motion carries thank you very much congratulations mark look forward to doing business next agenda item please seven b is the budget update with Ms Dodge

1:28:10foreign good evening mayor Jones and members of the council good evening I'm Mary Dodge your administrative Services director and I'm here tonight with our first real budget update this is something that we talked about doing when we were passing the budget back in June but we didn't

1:28:28really determine at that point what we wanted it to look like and and and what the form was going to take so at this time we've after we reviewed quite a few of the reports that come right out of our system we picked a couple that we think are representative of the type of

1:28:45review that we want to do at this time which is a relatively summarized review during the update and we will get more detailed in the mid-year and at the final so the first report that we've prepared and both of these are for the period of July 1 through October 31st

1:29:00and the first one is the budget by account classification and this report summarizes for the general fund through all divisions by Major classifications such as property and other taxes Personnel Services other supplies items in that manner the other report is budget by

1:29:19organization and in that report it's intended to provide more detail by division so we can drill down a little bit and to see where the thing the problems might pop out or the variances that we just need to address would show and any other detail for line items or

1:29:37is always available upon request so as we've talked before one of the issues in reviewing the variances too early in the year is it's really hard to see what happens especially in Revenue so what you can do is look at Trends and as we do this what will happen is in a

1:29:54few years these Trends should be really apparent and you'll be able to see earlier than ever if there is an issue so for this year if we look at property taxes one of the things that we did learn revenues overall and and the property taxes were going to be down we

1:30:10found that out in July right after the budget came out when the assessed valuation was lower so we're estimating that that is going down by 300 000 but we also found out that our sales tax and loan number is going to be adjusted up by 240 000 this is a pretty solid uh

1:30:28number and this is pretty much offset on the adjustment that went down in the previous year other things that we can identify that are differences from what we anticipated in June is that we should be getting more money from the op well we will get more money from the office of emergency

1:30:45services because the fire department had more call-outs than anticipated and the franchise fees will be going up and we did not budget for the increase that we just heard about uh this evening so essentially that means that at this point the revenue projections are

1:31:03overall holding and over time we feel that things will be and there are no adjustments no course Corrections necessary which is I think what this update would be identifying or trying to focus on so expenditures are much easier to project on a monthly basis because they

1:31:24kind of March down in a nice little tune and they're easy to see especially since Personnel costs are 80 percent and they are very easy to monitor at this point in the budget it it shows that we have a favorable variance overall with a one percent favorable reduction and that

1:31:41includes we have placeholders for the savings that we anticipate and it also we're anticipating that the two-year service credit some of the major openings and savings will be coming up in the second half of the year so another classification and expenditures that shows a variance and

1:32:02this is when we talk about every year and we do talk about it at mid-year as well and that's that we pay our insurance premiums in the very beginning of the year they are a very large Bill and they kind of front load the percentage so the division of Employee Services is always out there in front

1:32:20with a large variance but it is an understandable and understandable item so other questions that we have that have come up is um there was a question in Professional Services in the engineering department this was for a traffic study this was a question from the council we received

1:32:41today it was for a traffic study that could be done is actually they're planning on doing it now out of gas tax after we have had this discussion there was another question on other purchase Services out of the recreation department and that was a line item that

1:32:58was at 78 percent and the reasoning behind that is it's the payment the first payment that is due for the residential camp program so once they make that one in the first part of the year it front loads the expenditures as well but doing a review like this at this

1:33:16high level definitely allows the council and the staff to make sure that a a good long look is is going on and that we are uh on track on where we intended to be these reports these same reports were presented to the Fab at their November 13th meeting and uh and and they made

1:33:36two suggestions they suggested that since we have Integrated Waste Management with a 10-year plan and some long-term functions that we might want to consider including it in the next update and they also suggested that we take and we provide individual line item

1:33:53details for the revenue category of property and other taxes and since that is such a significant number and is is will be subject to trends that we can really analyze I think that was a an excellent suggestion and so with that um we will be back it's gonna be back at

1:34:12mid-year to be able to determine more detailed individual line items and see if there are any adjustments that we need to make but at this time it appears that we're we're going pretty well on track and if you have any questions I'll be happy to answer them right

1:34:28um I the Fab stole one of my questions which was can we divide the property and other taxes into into a finer detail but I would ask there are two other large ones intergovernmental revenues and charges for services um is there any Merit to please consider Merit to dividing those into smaller

1:34:47units as well so we can track Trends across some of those Revenue departments as well so I'm hoping that you'll consider that is it possible I guess that's my question but you may not know the answer tonight it's possible variances that is at this point if I could find them out if you'd like

1:35:07but it's always it's always possible to give more detail it's also possible at this point I think one of the focuses that we wanted to do was to try to make this be out of the new world system and be able to be generated from there I kind of like the independence of this is just straight

1:35:22out of the system there's been no accruals there's been nothing like that but we could run the report by line item and that would show excuse me the individual different tax stuff and we could do trends my new new world you mean that that is the program that we're using is the the

1:35:42city's Finance system yes okay thank you I have a follow-up question that in a number of uh software systems if you go to an item and double click on it you can get a another report that is in fact that detail for that item so that you can do that without um having to print a lot of stuff out is

1:36:03is that possible in New World it's possible but it's only possible to really be viewed if you're looking at the screen that's that's how we could potentially do a presentation we could have new world up there and and could look at some items but to be able to make it be a little bit more static and

1:36:20and uh posted on the agenda packet and uh transparent in that manner it would have to be printed out um someone couldn't take advantage of the computer system to enable um a question that might come up about a particular item that doesn't come up about you know as an exception

1:36:46so that for example if it were on the Internet or something and then where everyone would have access to it controls owner finance system even from A View capacity I don't think that we have in any manner people who are able to come externally and access even view

1:37:07the finance I'm sure that at some point in time especially with some of the new Cloud capabilities it could be possible but at this time we do not have that well I guess what I've seen done in some other with other software sometimes is that the um this the report might be

1:37:25translated into some other software that in fact has a simple capability of doing that kind of thing and it really what it does when you can do that is it enables you to sort of flip back and forth between the detail and the overall level because usually it's just a couple things where you

1:37:46might have questions about it and you don't really know ahead of time what that is so it just is a lot of it's a nice feature but you wouldn't it wouldn't even have to be inside that system if you could trans you know if it could if the um the report that's produced by

1:38:06um our computer system could then be fed into some other software that in fact has that capability sometime that that now the reports that come out of our system are generated and turned into a regular PDF file which doesn't have any drill down capabilities um but that would be something that

1:38:29would be very nice I'm sure for people to be able to do some of their own research at this point the only way we can answer those kind of more detailed questions is to be able to look look it up and present information thanks thanks for trying just one clarification question on the

1:38:49sales tax in lieu of property taxes the increase of 240 000 is that calculated based on our sales tax in the city or is it calc does the state allocate that money based on sales tax or based on per capita just out of curiosity based on sales it's always a year late and it has any

1:39:08of the adjustments that they put in there for you know um I think that one of them had to do with the old Home Depot adjustment that we think got reversed as part of what this one was but we don't know all of the adjustments but the so the Board of Equalization uh has has made an

1:39:26adjustment of a significant amount that we're trying to find more detail about which is why we know that the amount is higher okay interesting and it's from a year ago great so it's probably some individual big item not just generally our sales tax are higher than other places it's

1:39:44more of one decision correct okay thank you well I think that's it uh thank you very much it's good to see good to hear that we're on track uh and uh we're watching everything very carefully so thank you very much next agenda item please 7c amendment of El Cerrito Municipal Code chapter 8.12

1:40:08collection and disposal of waste stream Mr Schultz thank you honorable mayor and council members once again for those viewing at home I'm Garth Schultz I'm an environmental analyst in the Environmental Services Division here in El Cerrito and I operate the functions and programs and

1:40:30Staffing and everything up at their cities Recycling and environmental Resource Center thank you for considering us tonight we the recycling center is you probably know is a well-loved well-utilized asset here in El Cerrito um both before its reconstruction into

1:40:48the the new facility and also since um we've have many many satisfied customers every day we've gone from an average of maybe 250 to 300 visits per day to spikes on the weekends on sometimes in the 500s or 550s and so visitorship is is alive and vibrant up there at the facility

1:41:10but before reconstruction even since and probably more importantly since we received some complaints about specific types of behaviors up at the facility and these complaints have become I think a bit more apparent in that we have a new well-designed visible and transparent

1:41:29Place some of the problems that we had in the old facility with respect to traffic or bins or people's concerns about personal safety dealing with traffic and bins are ameliorated in the new facility and so it makes these other behavioral issues I think seem even more

1:41:45apparent but we've received a number of complaints over the years and the main types of activities that that are complained about are as follows users of the Book Exchange taking too many books or being aggressive with other patrons people taking materials from the recycling collection bins

1:42:01people getting on or into those recycling bins and entering restricted staff areas people parking or staying in the facility for many hours or all day long or all week long and groups of people loitering and taking recyclable materials from other patrons or from

1:42:17their vehicles prior to the Reconstruction of the facility we did a series of community workshops to get community input and user input on what folks liked about the recycling center what they didn't like and what they wanted to see included in a new facility and based on feedback

1:42:36from these meetings we developed a set of Draft rules of conduct for the facility that were essentially Common Sense rules be can be courteous share get along and we this was at the kind of the request of kind of the variety of user groups up there just to help

1:42:53retain a little sense of order and we posted those both during the temporary facility and there are also posted rules in the exchange Zone and Elsewhere on site now the detail some of these basic Common Sense rules unfortunately the complaints keep coming in and from our staff perspective we

1:43:08believe it's it's time to take a somewhat more straightforward and visible approach to to some of these problems um so part of what we're proposing tonight is the ability to develop and post rules at the site that will limit and control some of these problematic

1:43:30behaviors one in particular is the issue of Salvage of valuables from the facility there are a few areas where the the community and also from a staff perspective we really have set aside to be specifically for Salvage The Exchange Zone which includes the ever popular

1:43:48Book Exchange is one of them that's an area that's being set aside to be you know this is where you can come and take items and there are some restrictions that we're proposing to those items in terms of the quantity that's being taken and obviously we want to make sure

1:44:00they're safe and appropriate exchangeable items there's also an area for reusable packaging an area for bikes where you can salvage bike parts or complete bikes in an area for planting pots and the like and those are just areas where we know people are going to

1:44:15bring and take and that that's okay as long as it's within reasonable quantities the other materials on site though from scrap metal to styrofoam to batteries are are really intended to be a one-way in Outlet or one way in container where it's a donation of recyclables to the

1:44:32city so that we can recycle them and the vast majority of those materials are things that the city makes Revenue off of to support the ongoing operations of the facility and keeps the rates from going higher there's a couple perspectives on this we've we've heard from many members of

1:44:48the community regular users community members folks who are up there who say well but if there's something in a bin that is is of value isn't it better to be able to reuse that than to have it strictly recycled and the answer is absolutely yes if there is a usable iron

1:45:01in the scrap metal bin and you can use that iron I mean ironing for ironing board and it's functional and it's better at reuse I mean just from an environmental standpoint and an economical standpoint it's not going to hurt the bottom line overall for one iron to be salvaged and if it's

1:45:15providing a positive benefit for that that user that's great or there's folks who Salvage stamps for stamp collections or coupons for for shopping there's other extremes on the Salvage which is folks taking truckloads of scrap metal and then supposedly going and selling it for value or folks taking

1:45:31uh you know vast quantities of electronics for for reasons we're not entirely sure about but we presume flea markets or other types of Salvage activities and the The Dilemma we faced with this is not wanting to be unreasonable and restricting all Savage from these areas

1:45:47but also wanting to control for the the Salvage activities that have a material impact upon the city's bottom line in operating that Enterprise but also um to people's safety and the intent of the overall operation so what we're proposing on Salvage in specific is a

1:46:03permit process by which people would need to seek permission to salvage from those restricted bins I.E not the exchange Zone and the other zones I mentioned those are still permit free but these other one-way in containers would require a permit that would come

1:46:19in current unless there's a Fiat ever adopted in the master fee schedule it would be a no-cost permit to be able to State who you are what you're looking to salvage why you're looking to salvage it and the quantities that you're looking at so that we could make a determination

1:46:33meaning that the city manager his doesn't need can make a determination as to whether it's in a valuable Salvage and what we hope to achieve by this is that the folks that are doing it for personal profit or taking large quantities are going to be turned off by

1:46:47the idea and that we're going to be able to limit their activity on the site and that we've established for the folks that are salvaging these smaller items and doing it on a regular basis or have an art project or a school project and want to come Salvage materials that

1:47:00we're able to to grant them that access because there is a good need that served by that so overall we've proposed some amendments to the language of El Cerrito Municipal Code chapter 8.12 which pertains to collection and disposal of the waste stream and among the changes

1:47:17included I mentioned the permitted Salvage but the others are to enable the city manager to control the activities at the center that are hazardous dangerous or not in the best interests of the citizens of El Cerrito set a maximum number of daily hours a patron

1:47:31may spend at the facility set a maximum time limit for parking at the center and control and limit the salvaging materials at the facility um overall we don't see a direct Financial impact of this in except in that we hopefully can keep some of the valuable materials from leaving in mass and pick

1:47:48up truck beds and the like but overall really it's an intention to preserve the quality of the facility and ameliorate some of the complaints we've had about people feeling intimidated or not welcomed up at the facility when some of these activities are going on I'm happy

1:48:05to answer any of your questions I know it's a somewhat complicated matter but we're we're eager and excited to try to work on some of these activities up at the facility okay great um yeah as you were going through this I was um visiting the ordinance again and you

1:48:27know I was hoping that you might have a chance to grab the ordinance and look at um I have it here 8 12 0 2 0 definitions item l Salvage permit the second sentence in there says Salvage permits are subject to the provisions in Section 8 12 140 C and I'm I'm not sure did you mean 8 12

1:48:54150 which is the whole section on Salvage permits you are correct that is an error um we previously had a 12 150 as 812 140c um so yes thank you we would need to make that change in order to make that correct so that's now 150c 12 150 straight thank you for that

1:49:20page two of two of the actual ornaments my apologies for missing that no no worries that's that's one of the Privileges I I read the like council member Abelson said I read the presentation I heard your presentation and and but I was able to actually go through and do a little fact checking

1:49:43that's that's it for me thank you perfect thank you um yes um the concerns that I I have and I I maybe you can lay it is that um it's the little guy who will no longer do it because it starting like for example the one on page on attachment one page five says under on that page section B the

1:50:10Salvage permit application procedure is as follows and so there are all these steps they have to you have to supply proof of qualifications pay a fee if applicable um meet with staff or whoever um and then there's a written notification you don't just go get the stuff

1:50:33it's going to be like a long drawn out process so it looks to me like it would heavily discourage the person who just wants a few things for an art project they wouldn't go through this process it would be the vendor coming in to resupply whatever they're doing they would be the ones who would

1:50:53go through this process so I'm a little concerned about how cumbersome this would be to the small individual well two Commons and thank you for raising them one is that the language here provides us the opportunity to be more stringent as needed if you look at the final attachment here which

1:51:13is the actual draft permit application that we've drafted up this is something that we've intended to be something that can be filled out on site by the individual provide some basic documentation such as just their name address phone number stuff that we can verify that they're real we'd like to

1:51:30know what vehicle they're in so that if we know they're there it helps us establish hey yep we already know that person they've got the permit they're taking some materials it's within the guidelines that they've already told us they'll do so the intention here is that

1:51:42this is something that's available at the front counter and in the yard on weekends with our staff and if folks start seeking to salvage and don't already have the Salvage permit they would they would fill it out on the spot with respect to your the second point

1:51:57which is that it's going to be the vendor who's going to go through the process we specifically prohibit the sale of materials from this Salvage type of activity we do not intend for people to be granted a salvage permit if their stated intention is to go and sell that material or if we

1:52:17can you know determine otherwise even if they aren't stating it that we we know that they're selling um which would be somewhat complicated but we could probably establish it it's really not intended to be for folks to collect material for sale okay but when I go back to that initial section

1:52:33that I referred to an attachment one page five section b a um it says applicant you know applicant must supply all required proof of qualifications uh blah blah blah qualifications of of what if they're an individual they you know that's those are words I would associate with a business not an

1:52:58individual um I mean were you talking about a child has to have qualifications to use construction paper that you might find that you know I mean it doesn't it doesn't um I guess what I would say is that section that I'm now referring to seems a little harsh if there were just a form and you

1:53:18had to fill it out um that maybe would be okay but what if you don't have a dry although what if you don't have a driver's license I don't what do you does that mean you can't have it um you know so I it's just starting um I think it's just a little bit too stringent

1:53:47for um a casual user to want to participate in um I certainly don't support you know like in the book exchange where people come in and take or would have been previously taken like cases of books that they would use to you know re-furnish their stores but I'm not sure

1:54:12that we have a way of telling whether or not I mean always what comes in as a person right but I don't know how we can tell if they have a business behind what they're doing or if it's a volunteer project or if they're just wanting to show their child how to make things

1:54:32um I don't know how we differentiate that well I I certainly I understand where it's coming from for you and I'd certainly be open to changes to help make that a safer I think one of the or more accessible but I think one of the things to keep in mind is that the

1:54:48Salvage activities are not the intended use of most of these areas that we're talking about we've set aside areas where the intended use is salvaged in exchange and that it's appropriate and that that this per Salvage permit process wouldn't apply it's really for

1:55:02the things that are going into a large metal container where there's going to be hopefully not all that many instances where we have people applying for the Salvage most folks aren't going to be you know bringing along Grabber or a ladder in something and wanting to get

1:55:18into the bins I mean these are high bins these are used electronics we don't want to incentivize this too much for folks but we also want to provide an Avenue through which if they really need to do it we can get there but I'd be amenable to to other ways of doing it of

1:55:33course so would it be possible maybe and I'd have to look back through this again to see would it be possible to specify what categories of material would be covered by this so that we would exclude things like um the things that go into art projects that children would use or that we we

1:55:52use on Earth Day for example you know those that those kinds of a thing what I'm hearing you say now would not be included included in this is that correct the we wouldn't be requiring Salvage permits from folks collecting materials from specific areas of the facility that are set aside and

1:56:11designated for that type of collection okay do we say that somewhere we do where it is one moment please it would seem to be the place we would want to say it is on attachment three which is the form and we could list it there that would be that would be fine um

1:56:47and then everybody would know that that that's what it would cover and I did go to some of those meetings where people were complaining about you know people taking too many books and this and this and that and that you know so I did hear a lot of those concerns

1:57:04and I do sympathize with those people so I'm not really wanting to encourage a lot of that but I also don't want to discourage the um people from using the system that we're intending to use it so I think I've probably said enough but anyway if I think changing

1:57:25maybe adding words to the form that would make it indicate what it is actually intended to cover like if you're talking about the bin that where all that metal goes in um and I'm and even I mean if you're an artist and you're making uh and you you are you're in your living

1:57:46that way and you're looking for pieces of scrap metal to use in a particular project is are you intending that to be covered or not covered absolutely and it is an informal way now if folks are coming to the facility and they start rifling through a metal band we go hey what what are you

1:58:02doing uh what's the purpose of of your you know what's the reason to to dig in this bin um partially because we want to establish if they're taking it to be able to sell or whatnot and be able to inform them if that's that that's not appropriate and if they say oh I'm

1:58:15working on an art project we're like great tell us about it we want to know something about it and I think that those are the kinds of qualifications and details we're looking for and that's what we're intending to capture from this form it's just hey what's your name

1:58:25what are you doing what's the stated intent and how much of it are you looking for and basic information so we can establish that you are really you um that's what we're trying to get at with folks like that or a similar correlator would be someone saying I'm in a sheet mulch my yard I could use a

1:58:41bunch of cardboard I want to come to the cardboard bin and get you know 500 square feet of cardboard we would we we do now and we we hope to formalize the process by which we say excuse me what's your intent with the cardboard when you you know this isn't something

1:58:58you can just go collect and resell we need to know why you're trying to take this out of the spins and then we can also assist you with that by the way cardboard is one of the hot items for profit these days correct it's a it tends to sell on around 200 a ton depending upon the markets and scrap

1:59:18metal is you know very valuable and the electronics are very valuable okay thank you I'm finished thank you uh no okay uh thank you for the report um I did and I think I remember talking to you almost a year ago about uh one of the complaints I got about uh the book

1:59:39vendors being out front so I do know it and Mr Paul Dvorak also provided basically supporting your efforts here had a few suggestions on what may be to include but I have some questions first of all um has the police looked at this for enforcement yes we've discussed and met

2:00:02with them specifically Captain Regan on the topics of the rules the the Avenue for enforcement and we have a a plan going forward if if this ends up being adopted to meet and discuss the enforcement strategy discuss it with our staff make sure we're presenting a

2:00:17consistent face okay great and uh one of the things Mr Dvorak had recommended is placing limitations on parking on the block of Schmidt Lane leading into the facility and what's your take on that is it causing problems um what what there is a longer term parking

2:00:41that's happening on that block by users of the facility right now specifically folks who spend a longer duration on site and this is all week long it has been suggested elsewhere within staff that that might be a consideration moving forward I think that would require a different type of

2:01:00action than we're discussing here that's correct um but it would have some interesting effects um it would it would certainly discourage some of you know by virtue of enforcement of parking some of the longer duration and stays and um hang abouting at the facility

2:01:18thank you I think you've answered that one pretty good okay uh you did mention is also the staff report and also tonight that you had Community meetings uh in the staff report it says uh 2010 have you had uh more recent meetings than those in 2010 yeah so they they went from 2010 through

2:01:38early 2011 prior to the construction of the facility and then we had another one that was announced to the community and more specifically the users of the exchange Zone in the book exchange just before the opening of the facility to discuss the uh the you know the initial

2:01:55rules of conduct that I mentioned that they were there and that we'd been continuing to receive complaints and if we if things didn't change we would need to take more direct action and so this this is the result of that correct and we are planning a community meeting for all

2:02:11users of the facility and all community members If This Were to be adopted prior to doing any enforcement of it so that everyone's fully aware of our plans okay thank you very much thank you any other questions yeah I do unfortunately uh councilmember abelson's

2:02:28questions caused me to read this a little more carefully the um the agenda bill is very clear on the end of page two it says it should be noted that permits will not be required for the Book Exchange in the exchange Zone however the exchange Zone Book Exchange and exchange zone are

2:02:53not discussed at all in the ordinance as a matter of fact in the ordinance it clearly says that except for materials designated by the recycling center staff as being available for Salvage it's unlawful for any person other than employees or contractors to remove

2:03:10materials so except for materials designated by the the staff so nowhere in here does it talk about the exchange Zone I guess what and that's I think what council members abelson's point was and and it's up to your discretion so you may decide at some point in time

2:03:31that books are fall into this category because if you go down into 150 a the design name a grant an exemption to 140b to individuals removing certain items uh in the recycling center right now that includes the exchange Zone um and so therefore they need a salvage

2:03:54permit you could cause somebody to need a salvage permit for the exchange Zone the way this is written today so um I think what cable the council member abelson's point was it should be very clear that you don't need a permit for the exchange Zone and that's what your

2:04:10agenda Bill said and I took it at face value and um now I'm reading this a little closer and it doesn't say that in the ordinance it's clearly as it does in the agenda bill so I'm just curious what you would recommend well if if it pleases the council that line in 8.12 150 a the

2:04:31second sentence of the first paragraph certain categories of items as designated and specially marked by City staff either we could specify here exactly which categories of items which would be very clear but unfortunately would mean we need to come back for a municipal code Amendment if we were to

2:04:47change the categories no I understand I understand the desire to leave the categories open because today it might be uh you know steel paper cardboard and tomorrow it might be styrofoam and we forgot to put Styrofoam in there so I understand why you want to designate

2:05:05which items in the restricted area you can designate for for recapture but I don't understand why the exchange Zone the items that are in the exchange Zone um aren't aren't automatically excluded from this from 150. yeah what we actually meant by that sentence is not

2:05:25designating the areas that require the Salvage permit but that's designated for ongoing Salvage and or reuse available to all patrons probably what that should have said was without permit and if you wanted to have a bit more specificity as to which areas don't require a permit we

2:05:41could include that here okay now I'm confused you're talking about areas or items categories of items as designated and specially marked may be designated for ongoing Salvage and or reuse available to all patrons I think what we meant there was without permit so that sentence is about the setting

2:06:00aside those areas the the categories of materials I.E books and the items in the exchange ones being available for ongoing Salvage at all times without permit here we could specify more clearly what those were okay so now you're saying items and I'm talking areas

2:06:17I'm talking The Exchange Zone and so I'm just curious why you're avoiding using the word exchange Zone um we wanted the ability to designate other categories as well I'm happy to include exchange Zone in here as a parenthetical behind categories of items we just we

2:06:34want to Define categories of items not areas of the facility knowing that the areas of the facility May fluctuate over time we wanted to specify categories of the items that would be available for ongoing Salvage without permit without permit so um so I just moved into the hypothetically

2:06:53I just moved into El Cerrito and I pick up this ordinance and I want to know what I need to get a salvage permit for and I read this ordinance How Will I Know What I what doesn't what I can salvage without a permit the plan is to mark that especially on-site via signage

2:07:10so one in the exchange zone for example says this area is not subject to salvage permit and then also has some some details about items or as is and the like just to make sure that folks are understanding that we don't make any guarantees about them that's designated and specially marked I

2:07:28try to assist yeah thanks please I think if I'm understanding this and this is the way that I've always read it is things only go into the exchange Zone if they are in the category of things that do not require a permit so however the exchange zone is not the only it's not exclusively the place

2:07:46where things go that don't need a permit because there might be compost for example which is outside the exchange Zone but it but any anything that is in the category of not requiring a permit is going to be marked as such correct it's not exactly what it says yet but

2:08:01but it is as designated and specially marked by City staff well so as designated yeah and and um I'm going to designate which categories of things do not require a permit The Exchange Zone The Book Exchange and anything else that does not require a permit is going to be marked

2:08:25on site in that way so I'm going back to the definition of Salvage and it was minor is Salvage does the book do are books bicycles included in the definition of Salvage because you're using the sentence Salvage here ongoing salvage or reuse I guess you're saying reuses the books

2:08:47are in the ReUse the whole point so books are in reuse so this so what you're saying is because it says or reuse available to all patrons that you're including the exchange Zone well Salvage is defined as a verb not as a thing as a type of thing yeah active accessing those materials from the

2:09:11recycling center that can be reused or repurposed by individuals so Salvage includes everything at the site but you only need a permit for the things that are not designated or the things that are the things that require a permit will be noted as everything that you can take without a permit will

2:09:29be noted you can salvage books and you can salvage exchange Zone materials and you can also at illegally Salvage metal without a permit salvage means all of those things but then what's the point of reuse a letter i reuse this I thought reuse was was the things you could do without a

2:09:53permit the use occurs so once you reuse it art and art supplies books and antiques it's reused okay fine um so without a permit at the end of that sentence of letter of the first paragraph a may add the clarity that council member Abelson and I are looking for can you read it please

2:10:21certainly when we find the beginning of the sentence page are you on page four of the actual uh ordinance um section that one attachment one section 8.12.150 last sentence a of section A Certain categories of items as designated and specially marked by City staff

2:10:45okay um may be designated for ongoing Salvage and or reuse available to all patrons without a salvage permit so just to be clear if if we support this change in the ordinance then this would have to come back to us no because we're reading it for the first time tonight yeah we're

2:11:11okay is that correct okay that's correct great that's the reason why you got to get it right the first time so that you don't have to read it three times yeah so can I ask a question is is there any hurry on this I mean not particularly in that there's no drop dead data which

2:11:34things are going to change materially but it's something we are anxious to to begin addressing on site because the complaints continue to come in I I hear what you're saying I'm just wondering though if this isn't a good um if it wouldn't be a good use of the Environmental Quality committee to look

2:11:49at this I'm open to it just I mean understand that that's now and even if you introduce it tonight I just want to make sure the time frame is understood if you introduce it tonight it won't be adopted until I assume it'll come back on the December 4th no it will

2:12:07not so basically it will not be on your agenda for adoption until January December 17th I'm sorry I forgot about the second meeting better because we're setting our garbage rates that night December 17th there'll be another night of garbage yes 30-day delay so it won't

2:12:22be in effect until January mid-January um so you're already looking at two months of um of of these rules not being in effect for staff to enforce now obviously ultimately it's up to the city council if you believe that the eqc is it should take a look at this I just want you all

2:12:39to understand that that this has been a couple months in development already um staff has said that these are complaints that are ongoing and so it's it's it's something they would like to have enough the concern I have is that I can see some new complaints complaints

2:12:53coming which are from users of the recycling center with these rules in effect um and I can think of a whole new kind of set of uh complaint about having to provide ID in order to to use the recycling center uh I mean just to be clear to provide ID to use the recycling center for

2:13:16something it's not supposed to be used for today to access a restricted area and remove remove products that have been provided to the city for our Revenue that's what the that's what the permit provides them the Salvage permit allows them to go into restricted areas and

2:13:35remove assets of the city for their use that's what the Salvage permit allows but I'm seeing this being presented in the other way which is that we're talking about everything else we're not talking about this area so I'm just feeling like it needs some user eyes on it

2:14:00um and um it just doesn't you know it concerns me I think I think you could pass it tonight there's enough the whole thing gives the city staff the flexibility of setting this up so that if the Environmental Quality would like to comment there's room within the ordinance that is being

2:14:29proposed to make those changes correct you you could meet with the quality and board you could take their recommendations they may have some things that they think should be considered and not be considered in this and this gives you the leeway to do that correct and we could even do that before

2:14:46it comes back for its second reading right so I would suggest that we could if there's if there's flexibility or changes needed in that particular thing it allows the staff to do that and it would just be a matter of um getting together with staff there I'm still quite confused about it even

2:15:09myself because I'm saying you have to it can only be done by an individual for individual use right is that correct I'm sorry oh I'm sorry the the material can only that is the idea of the material that would be taken is it would be by an individual for individual use

2:15:29right I I think the intention is it's for individual use that doesn't include sale I think if it's for individuals who used to help a school project or you know some other valuable organizational Mission that's that's one of the intents here is this so the example I gave was

2:15:46an artist making a piece of art that would be for sale the art would be but not as recyclable materials and I think we actually Define it as such in here that it would not be for sale as a recyclable material which is defined within the municipal code okay um so

2:16:07it's it's it's this whole idea of it being go ahead Melanie mints the city's environmental services division manager and um I just wanted to add a few things regardless of whether we decide to put it back to the Environmental Quality committee before proceeding

2:16:25the intent is definitely and I think that we've shown it so far at the recycling center but it would make it would be not to make a really bureaucratic or unfriendly process and I think we would go out of our way and intend to use all of our communication strategies to let people know that

2:16:39um reuse of even materials that we collect is welcome for legitimate purposes and that would include art projects I think the word That's essential I think in terms of making money is we don't we collect Commodities and resell them to the recycle market and that does affect

2:16:57helps offset rates that rate payers pay so we don't want anybody collecting to resell things as a commodity however to incorporate it into an art project that might be for sale or otherwise is fine the other thing we've talked about of course in this and this addresses it is limited quantities you

2:17:14know we have some discretion so if somebody was had a whole industry going we'd and we actually recently did have somebody up there and said they have an industry growing how would we go about that and we talked about how we would compare it to rates that we're getting

2:17:25from someone else um so I think that we would probably we would try to create a very user-friendly interface for getting this permit and it really is meant to address a very very small percentage of increasingly problematic Behavior so to make it actually friendlier for people to come I

2:17:45think Garth has said it but I just want to reiterate the public meetings that we had in designing the recycling center all articulated that that kind of use and reuse was really the community's first goal so we don't want to make it a really high barrier we just want to

2:17:59establish really a point of contact and letting people really understand the issues um so I think something you brought up earlier council member Abelson instead of in Terms of children and other I think um I would have to reread this and hadn't um we thought about it but hadn't

2:18:14reviewed the language if somebody doesn't have a driver's license or is a child I mean I think we'd want the you know their parents signature anyway but I think we can we can work with different people and we just want to establish a point of contact and with the Environmental Quality

2:18:28committee I think that we could bring up the topic another one that's come up here tonight is the ReUse area when we rebuilt it bigger than the previous Book Exchange had been we'd hoped that it would have more kind of reusable art supplies office supplies but we always

2:18:42said to the community and the community meetings we need help organizing such efforts um so that might be something also as we proceed we've only been open now since April but to continue to further Define reuse if we're seeing things that should be moved into the ReUse area but some

2:18:59things like large cart we can't identify everything that somebody wants to use for an art project some of that isn't a scrap metal bin or in the electronics so I just wanted to emphasize that the programmatic implementation of this you know we'll have a lot of communication

2:19:12with the public and we have a lot of communication up there and are very accessible so we just want to be able to give us a mechanism to be able to curtail some of the um the salvaging that's happening the kind of aggressive salvaging that's happening and or just people taking too much and

2:19:29really beginning to see it as a Depot for them to get things of value as we've collected more and more variety that problem has has grown it's kind of an unintended consequence of our success and explain expanding the range of materials is attracting more people who

2:19:44want those materials so I just wanted to address the concern that um you know ordinances by necessity have a lot of a lot of words are are permit and our our communication around this will be a lot more friendly than the than the ordinance you know and we can let people we know let them know

2:20:04that it is available for their reuse um but that they just need to to establish a point you know to come talk to us and fill out a form thank you oh should we go on I'd like to hear from the public and their comments if there are any I have no speaker slips speaker slips anybody would like to

2:20:27address a Counsel on this okay let's bring it back to we have one oh excuse me Tom just two thoughts on this conversation Tom pants 7345 area mount El Cerrito um my son so I think you all know are disabled you know my wife won't let them go close to that to that area because

2:20:49she feels threatened by some of the people who are there at times and I really appreciate Garth and Melanie's efforts to try and clean that up I mean we can't just keep everybody away but we need to be careful about how we do that number two my sons have California IDs

2:21:00and they're you know you can go have alcoholic beverages with California IDs no reason has to be a driver's license thank you thank you so I do have some comments or or suggestions um and and it would be to again address another uh item that councilmember Abelson that you brought up and it would

2:21:21be on page five of attachment one Section 8 12 150 B the Salvage permit application procedure is as follows lowercase a um I would suggest that we strike the first sentence such that it reads applicants may be required to provide information and forms provided by the city period

2:21:47Salvage activities are subject to inserting the word two inspection prior to approval of a permit third sentence applicant may be required to show proof of information provided on application form because I clearly clearly if we're going to ask for evidence of residency or a driver's

2:22:11license or a California ID staff needs to be given that authority to ask for that information and I do believe that it can be done but it shouldn't be necessarily uh proof of qualifications I think it's just essentially show proof of information provided on application

2:22:29form yeah I like that I think that helps I'm assuming the legal issues for showing ID have been uh researched by legal counsel yes we've reviewed the ordinance including that requirement thank you so I've made two proposed changes to the ordinance um I'm hearing that those are generally an

2:23:01acceptance that I would like to go ahead and move the ordinance move it at least move it we can then discuss it if not I'd like to move an ordinance of the city of El Cerrito amending El Cerrito Municipal Code chapter 8.12 collection and disposal of waste stream with two modifications or I

2:23:22guess it's three actually three modifications one to definition l on page two of the ordinance one that added the words without a salvage permit at the end of section A on page four of the ordinance and then scratching the first sentence of lowercase a um inserting the word two and adding the

2:23:49sentence applicant may be required to show proof of information provided on application form a second to motion how about changing the driver's license requirement and yeah so the is is the is the form actually part of the ordinance no no the form is subject revision is

2:24:13not that is not being approved by the ordinance so our action tonight does not approve the form the form is subject to can be changed by staff and I'm assuming it would be changed over time as they learn what they actually need to ask that's correct so so it's included in

2:24:28the packet for the council's information so so with regards with regards to the motion the motion I would not change but I certainly would encourage staff to be more open-minded about the the things that you request in the form so noted second in recommendation right that's okay feel

2:24:48free to make a recommendation is there any okay so there is discussion yeah there is discussion so um I would ask just on the form that the um the vehicle information not be required in because maybe the person didn't come on in a vehicle and doesn't have one and

2:25:10that the driver's license number be likewise changed in some way to um it just says identification number or something so that more people would qualify to use things the other thing is that I would like to ask that this be get that the Environmental Quality Committee in the period which is until

2:25:35January anyway right now we'll be reading this a second time in December when December 17th that is what it is so I don't know if there's I don't know what happened to Garth he's here he's hiding hi there isn't okay that in the meeting between that that the Environmental

2:25:51Quality committee be given an opportunity to make comments on it um and um those are those are the things I would like to see sure I I would like to emphasize the wording with with the changes that I've proposed in uh on page five the first sentence of that section now

2:26:12reads applicants may be required to provide information in forms so the informal method that's going on today would actually still be legitimate even within the ordinance because staff does not have to work to require the form be filled out so I just want to highlight the fact that by even though

2:26:35the first sentence previously said must supply all required proof of qualifications staff still built themselves a loophole of not having to require a written a written application so I just want to emphasize that you know applicants may be required to provide forms and the sentence that I

2:26:56wrote added applicant may be required to show proof of information provided on the application form both of those are allow staff to set a lot of flexibility with regards to that requirement I think I'll I'll just add one thing and that is that we're working we we have a casual use of

2:27:20the facility that we are have been allowing to happen but is not strictly permitted and I am happy that we're formalized I feel like when you put the rules out there that makes everybody at least know when they're breaking them or when they're not breaking them so to

2:27:34those who maybe at one time or another thought that it was okay to get into the bins and take things because they saw others doing it now at least we can be clear to say actually if you're going to do that we want to know who you are and why why you're doing it so I think this

2:27:46is a really good step forward and it'll make it I feel like when there are rules that everybody knows about then you can kind of operate a little bit more harmoniously in public spaces so thanks for the work on this and I look forward to hearing how this goes in

2:28:01implementation and hearing whether or not there we do end up getting complaints in the other direction of this being too restrictive um but I'm but given some of the complaints we've had so far this is probably the correct step forward yeah I would like to say it's it's

2:28:15pretty obvious that um from both the public and the staff standpoint that something needs to be done um I I'd like to also say that you know we put up the city has been operating and putting and and put up and continually supports the recycling center and have for a long

2:28:36time with the purpose of uh Community interaction that said I've never seen anything though where it says that the city has put up the recycling center so that other people can come take material and profit from it that wasn't the intent it's never been the intent as far as I know

2:28:57in addition because of the way we Finance public government these days we have to pay for the center with a dedicated funding stream or streams and this is one of them and uh I don't think I I think the intent is to actually curb that plus try to get some semblance of order who

2:29:23people who want to do things like go into the bins themselves which I have a real concern about uh Insurance wise and liability wise and even even though Common Sense would tell you you wouldn't do that in a facility like this that doesn't mean that um we're off

2:29:42the hook on that so I uh support that I also support that discretion and flexibility should be given to the staff in in setting these rules I'm very happy with the way the ordinance reads and the flexibility given and I think we can manage it I don't think um uh

2:30:09I don't think we need really a very focused and specific [Music] um a description of what should go in once you go out which it it it's very clear if the staff feels that this is an item that can be salvageable and shared it'll be so uh designated so um I hope that even though the quality

2:30:35control committee may want to you look at it um I think this is a very good basis and I I wouldn't see why you would want to change it all that much there may be some fine tuning and things like that but certainly the flexibility is there to do it to take in suggestions I would

2:30:54also suggest that if you are if there is a question about Schmidt lane or a Schmidt that you get with public works and get with the police and see if it's viable to take a look at that and see if that will also improve the activity around the center there so with that we do have a motion in a

2:31:19second can I ask a question that there have been several comments here made about getting into the bins but I don't remember seeing anything about that in what was being said except in the background in analysis unless I just missed it somewhere so I can't even tell from this that

2:31:39that's what we're trying to do actually are you asking whether or not we're trying to allow people to do it or we're trying to stop I don't that we're one I can't see anything this doesn't talk about the issue is keeping people out of the bins keeps them out of areas that they're not

2:31:57supposed to go into which would be but it doesn't say anything here in this it doesn't have the actual ordinance that it is about that it doesn't have to it does same paragraph that I've been editing in under B the Salvage permit application Salvage activities are

2:32:14subject to inspection prior to approval of a permit so they have to demonstrate how they're going to salvage things no that's not my question be including whether they're climbing into a bin or not it is Salvage activities are subject to inspection their Salvage activity is

2:32:31subject to approval is another way of saying what that says that's I don't understand the question maybe maybe restate it I think maybe I've actually spent a bunch of time up there recently because my daughter's been moving stuff in and out of everywhere under the world but but the

2:32:52um is everything that's in the Salvage category in a bin correct in to your question about whether or not getting any rules about getting into a bin are in here or not there it's not specifically called out the section is is allowing for for setting that as a rule is section 8.12

2:33:141.6 or sorry 8.12160 activities control whenever the city manager shall find that the welfare of any person will be best served by restricting the use of any portion of the El Cerrito Recycling and environmental Resource Center he or she shall control activities which are

2:33:29deemed to be of a hazardous nature wherever nature would endangered property or which if not in the best interest of the citizens in El Cerrito this is what's providing for the Authority for the city manager to set rules about activities on the facility including do not get into bins

2:33:49okay but so that's got nothing to do with that other section I guess right yes correct for if say if folks aren't salvaging council member Lyman is correct for for folks that are salvaging we can also restrict it for them specifically they should not interpret their Salvage permit uh

2:34:05approval to be carte blanched to get into bins because that'll be subject to inspection so he is correct in that sense but for folks that are just at the facility I mean granted they should be if they are getting into bins supposedly it's for salvaging but we want folks in

2:34:20bins on equipment in restricted staff only areas and this is the section of the the code that gives us the ability to set those specific rules at the facility so what I'm not saying is that it is that section that is it looks like it's more controlling the people who are

2:34:39in other places in the facility if it helps this is the same language that is in other parts of the municipal code with respects to parks and playgrounds wherein city managers granted the authority to set rules for parks and playgrounds I don't have a problem with

2:34:53that what I'm worried about is that um The Casual user who I think we're trying to support um is being micromanaged in such a way that they'll never um use this you know that they'll just not do it that's what I'm more concerned about which you may not get into bins or not

2:35:18come to this no I don't think getting into Vince I don't even see that as the issue well it's one of the issues we're working to address I think right but it's not what's like I don't see it discussed throughout here what I'm seeing is like you come and you want to

2:35:31just get an item and um and it's I wasn't presupposing that everything like that is in a bin because I've seen stuff that wasn't um and um that they would that it would be more if I were to I would think this would be more um pointed at the people who are the problem rather than the people who are

2:35:59not the problem I think I think the discussion should come back to the city council thank you Garth so you're you're concerned that this is restricting the people who want to use it more than the people that are we intended to use it if the people who we don't mind if they

2:36:18take something are being are the ones having to do everything and the I that's it just looks too much to me like that is what's happening here but um I also think that this is over um I'm I'm wondering why these aren't just rules that are um made by staff about the use of a

2:36:41facility that this is maybe more detailed than is needed to that is required in order to implement some rules because when you put it into an uh this is an ordinance right it's then hard to change you know it becomes difficult to change and maybe something isn't working

2:37:02right and so you want to change it I mean like when they put in parking here at the city hall we didn't have an ordinance about it you have a general ordinance that allows you to do that right so I don't know why it isn't working here well it is pretty General but anyway anyway those are the kinds of

2:37:20you know those are the kinds of things that I'm thinking about and I'm thinking about all the complaints we'll get for for doing this okay um with the people the little guys who are very unhappy about it um we'll see if that occurs but I understand your concerns any other

2:37:38comments okay there's been a motion in a second uh all those in favor aye aye aye opposed aye uh 3-1 motion pass thank you very much next item please next item is Central Avenue and Liberty streetscape improvements staff report thank you thank you mayor and Council I'm Jerry

2:38:11Bradshaw the Public Works director this item is almost a carbon copy of a of the last Construction contract award I brought to you about a month ago as before this one asks you to reject the lowest bid as non-responsive it asks you to authorize the city manager to award a contract to regrick

2:38:34construction yes the same company that won the last one and as before the bids came in significantly higher than expected and once again we're uh inserting into the process an opportunity to to Value engineer the project as we come up with the final contract price through the change order

2:38:59process however we're approaching this one a little bit different than the the portrayal project from last month in this case the value engineering we don't expect to have bare enough fruit to close the budget gap on the project and in this case we're actually identifying specific funds we're

2:39:19recommending to to close the budget shortfall on this I'd like to bring up a couple issues that are are bigger than this project and are not really mentioned in the agenda bill when we brought before we even brought you the Potrero project a month ago we had already opened the bids on this the

2:39:38second project in a series of projects and as you know from last month the protero project came in over budget this one comes in even further over budget to have one project over budget is bothersome to say the least to have a second in a row be over budget was a

2:39:56signal for some real trouble and we also had three more federally funded projects in the queue ready to go out to bid in the next few months so at that time we started scrambling around trying to figure out how to close these budget gaps with this whole queue of of ultimately five federally funded

2:40:16projects uh out to bid or ready to go out to bid we called the Contra Costa Transportation Authority for help they are the this County's agency through which federal funds passed to us and they are really are the experts on on these federal funds as well as other

2:40:33programs to see if there was other available funding that could be moved our direction to help fulfill these these gaps they went to work and tried to find some some additional funding for us or really all they could come up with is the upcoming funding for the next federal Paving

2:40:53cycle which is part of the obag program the whole Federal funding in the Bay Area is Shifting to a new structure but they are still planning on having Federal funding money coming to all the cities in the next cycle when we first started we thought that that amount coming to us was about four

2:41:11hundred and sixty thousand dollars during the process we learned that it actually was going to grow to about six hundred and thirty thousand dollars of federal funds for Paving they told us that that money would be available to reprogram to any of these projects because it's a of a type of

2:41:29federal funds the STP funds that are very flexible and could be moved over this if we were willing to give up a federal Paving project in the future or or diminish it to some extent to move funds to these since our measure a program and Street condition is in actually pretty healthy

2:41:49shape we felt that that would be an acceptable way to fund these projects a series of projects so we actually started the process to reprogram those funds to meet a deadline that was looming at the end of end of October the timing was very tight we knew that the this upcoming funding that we're

2:42:10hoping to use to supplement these wouldn't be available until next march or so and we have projects already bid that were ready to award and we have deadlines to get those out to award and get those completed with the original funding that's in place so we were in a

2:42:27squeeze trying to hurry up and get them done but also not go too fast and be able to take advantage of this upcoming funding CCTA staff finally learned that it wasn't going to be February March it was going to be more like April May or even June before those funds could be

2:42:42available at that point we threw in the towel and said there's just no way we can bring those two funding sources together to make these projects work short of throwing out all the bids and starting over next spring rebidding these projects again in a rising bidding Market that was not

2:42:57something we look forward to plus we would have had to ask for extensions on the deadlines for the original funds so at that point if once we realized we were contemplating giving up some future funding for Paving we realized that to bring measure a funding into these

2:43:14projects would really come to the same end preserve the federal funds for Paving next year and bring measure a funds into these um the portrayal project ended up actually tapping into a little bit of the measure a funding we didn't need Council Authority at the time because it

2:43:31was it's only funding actual Paving work as part of the patrol project and we already have a money programmed for Paving however in these projects we're asking for measure a form to be used anywhere on these projects which is more than just Paving they're really separate

2:43:45types of projects so that's why we've specified measuring funding to be used to supplement these measure a funds do qualify it's just that these programs are not in the capital Improvement program so thus the final recommendation to amend the CIP to include these

2:44:04projects in there so I just wanted to um alert you to the trend that we're seeing and the queue of projects we have lining up so as we look forward I just basically want to say we may be back again asking for more measuring money as we go forward I want to make

2:44:25sure you have that in front of you before you uh made the final consideration on this however one little epilogue to the story today we open bids on the third project and that project came in a little under engineer's estimate and within budget so I don't know where we stand on all

2:44:43this yeah be warned but maybe it's maybe uh maybe it's all Chicken Little at the end of the day still to come are two projects now today's project was actually fairly small in size it was about 140 000 it came in at 130 000 actually the final the lowest bid and um

2:45:03and looks like Redwood redwick did bid on it but they're not in the running so we should have a different contractor this time around so we just opened nose bits we haven't done an analysis to know where we are actually on who the final low bidder will be still to come uh the Mosier Ashbury

2:45:20project which is a pedestrian and bicycle improvements along the whole length of Mosier from the city limit to the community center and then on Moser Lane going up the hill from literally Richmond up to the top of the hill to make it more bicycle and pedestrian

2:45:34friendly that's on the order of about three quarters of a million dollars that project so that's still a bit of a wild card what we've seen on the bidding the the biggest increase in price has been on concrete work believe it or not the electrical work has not been up it's

2:45:49actually been a little bit down that's why the Arlington or the Arlington of Madera say Frost the school project today was a large part of electrical so we're hoping that that was a big factor but the concrete prices in there are settling back down again so we do have these other two projects

2:46:04the last one will be the Ohlone Greenway Crossings which will bid out later in the winter or early spring that's on the order of a quarter of a million dollars so we have about a million dollars worth of projects yet to bid I just want to alert you to that um the agenda Bill stress the changes in

2:46:22the construction cost there's brief mention given at the end of the financial section that we're also adjusting the amounts for the design part of the budget and the construction Administration part of the budget so I just wanted to alert you to that that is there we did not put much stress on that

2:46:39in the agenda bill um if you have any questions on those items I think I'll leave it at that point or any questions on the value engineering approach or the project itself I can go into any of that Janet yeah no I don't have any questions right no not tonight no thank you Jerry

2:46:59although you undermined your whole discussion with that epilogue about that last bit but thanks for letting us know about that a little little bright spot in the presentation yeah I was in rewrite this afternoon yeah I just wanted to emphasize when you talk about spending measure a money on

2:47:15this you're talking about using it for approved parts of the project related to the criteria in measure a correct yes yes you're not I don't want to give anybody the impression we're spending money outside the boundaries on that correct we're not you know buying

2:47:33police cars or playground equipment or things like that this is all approved within measuring great and it's 160 000 of measure a correct your that you're asking for right we don't expect to need that much but we wanted the flexibility and Authority because negotiations are just that plus I'm

2:47:51having to play my handle a little bit in public here as we go into negotiations such as life in the public sector so it's really hard to say exactly how that will go so we asked for a little extra Authority so 160 000 what what basically is the percentage of that for

2:48:06our yearly discretionary funding of measure a well we started off the year with about 750 000 a program for expenses this year I was holding 50 000 just for some programmatic and planning uh you know getting our payment program updated and some basic uh strategy and planning the prop the

2:48:27the program we took a hundred thousand out a couple of months ago for Traffic Safety so that brings us down to uh in the 600 000 range or maybe a little less so that's that's the universe of money that we're now asking to bite into here again okay and you introduced uh which I

2:48:46appreciate the The Briefing of the of the future projects and you're talking about a million dollars um is measure a part of that or is that all grant money or where's the um we do have some measure a money already programmed for the Moser Ashbury product a small slice is in there all

2:49:06right um so it would be expanding that if we had to go there for that okay so I guess where I'm getting that this year next year there'll still be money to do just regular Paving where we need it and repair work where we need it yes we've already done some minor repair

2:49:22work we're holding off doing the annual project to see where we end up with with this string of projects here so uh well we do hope to do some Paving uh this late spring early summer great thank you um it should be noted that the 160 000 that you're asking for is leveraging

2:49:39Federal grant money um you know in the tune of a little over six hundred thousand dollars of Federal grant money correct okay thank you hmm okay do we have any uh speakers on this no speaker slips okay bring it back to council do we have uh can we either comment or a

2:50:04proposed I'm happy to move the resolution mayor I move a resolution of the city council of the city of El Cerrito amending the capital Improvement program to transfer an amount not to exceed a hundred and sixty thousand dollars of measure a street Improvement funds from the annual street from the

2:50:21annual Street Improvement program to the Central Avenue and Liberty Street streetscape improvements project and authorizing the city manager to award a contract to graduate construction company in an amount to be determined after undergoing a value Engineering Process for the Central Avenue and

2:50:39Liberty streetscape Improvement project contract number c-3063 second it's been moved and seconded on the emotion questions just a question to council the agenda item in its in its uh advertisement form does do all sorts of things like rejecting bids and stuff like that do we need to read that into

2:51:01the record at all it's all covered in the resolution great thank you okay with that all those in favor aye opposed motion carries you know 7e Grant to writer coach connection okay I'll ask council member Rebecca thank you Mayor Bill um good evening council members I

2:51:27appreciate you uh putting this on the agenda thank you mayor for your help with that and I will be brief because then the night is waning um I'll be brief and I'll be interested in hearing what everybody has to say because I'm really interested in your thoughts

2:51:41The Writer's coach connection is a program that came to our attention earlier this year at least in this public in these Chambers Bob menzinger came and ever gave a presentation during our joint session with the school district subsequent to that he came and gave a fuller presentation I guess it

2:51:56was two or three meetings back discussing the program which operates at Portola Middle School in El Cerrito High School the program is primarily uh move forward or implemented by volunteers volunteers go to these schools and they do one-on-one tutoring with students

2:52:15um on their writing skills and we heard from a broad range of folks from the community including the volunteers who um praised the program we also saw a video where principals and teachers discussed how effective they thought the program was in helping students writings

2:52:33we also heard from parents particularly at Portola Middle School where some of the parents there noted they're really excited it's come to the school and hope to see it expanded and continue in future years so that that's the program and at that our last session where Bob did

2:52:50make his presentation he requested a 2500 Grant and his reasoning for the grant are first of all the need for the grant the program's expanding at the same time um the school district funding is less available and is has not been made as available as it had in the past or as he

2:53:07had hoped it would be the program needs funding primarily for a staff member to coordinate the work of the volunteers with the teachers and I think this is a really important function because the teachers then don't have to spend the time that they need to spend with the

2:53:20students working with the volunteer so that's primarily what they end up spending their money on um the other reason that he brought up which I thought was a very compelling reason for for the funding was it's not the amount of the funding in in his mind but the fact that the funding signifies

2:53:40City support for the program and that's something he can use on Grant applications to leverage outside money so I think that we can all agree this is a wonderful program that's you know according to the experts in our schools the principals and the teachers who are

2:53:54on the ground working it's an effective program and they they think it's great there are a lot of great programs in our community and this was something I thought about very carefully before bringing it up in a city council meeting and the reason I thought that this

2:54:06program is deserving of our consideration for showing our city support for the program are really comes down to the special place that I think schools have in a community um first at a very base level many communities as people are looking for homes they do consider the quality

2:54:27of the schools in the area and it's something that if nothing else it it would happen it has some sort of impact on the attractiveness of a community for from a home buyer's perspective or from a renter's perspective it's also schools are a representation of the community in a way that sort of

2:54:46all of our public buildings are I think and that's another connection we have with with the schools we don't run the schools but they're in our community and they're a public space where people you know they're one reason people come to El Cerrito another thing that I think is important

2:55:03to think of when we think of why schools are sort of important and are are maybe elevated to a high a high level or a high level of consideration by the city is sort of the cohesion I can't tell you how many times I've heard mayor Jones or and or council member Chang mentioned

2:55:20that they attended this or that school there's a certain camaraderie that comes along with and a certain identity for a community that people hold on to for many years after after they've gone to the school so as I was thinking about this these are the things that came to mind and

2:55:35this is the reason I wanted to bring this forward to to you all once I came to the conclusion I thought this was a good idea then I had to come up with how this might happen and it was only at that time after I had asked Bob of menzinger many questions about the

2:55:51program that I then went to staff to talk about how in the past the city might have handled this sort of thing how a council member might ask ask that this be brought forward and it was only at that point that I realized that the city already has a procedure in place a

2:56:07policy and procedure in place for grants that really had not really has not been used much in in previous years the administrative policy was given to us all at our desks here so in 2005 the city council at that time passed a policy for co-sponsorship which we've we've seen many times where

2:56:26non-profits will ask to use our facilities for a reduced rate but I hadn't realized that in that policy there's also a procedure for a group to request a grant from the city some City staff research revealed that this had only been used twice maybe in the last decade or so once for a Martin Luther

2:56:44King march and at that time after that had been granted then the March became part of the HRC budget and also to provide support for the Ed fund and after that Grant had been provided then the Ed fund contribution became part of the base budget I believe through our

2:57:01attendance at the dinner um so that I might have been informed incorrectly there is some support given to the Ed fund I'm not sure what form it comes in so there is a procedure in place um it asked that the group come to the city council during the budget period I'd

2:57:21like to suggest that we we made these rules and I think we can make an exception if we decide if we choose this route and that accepts the reason for the exception would be that the writer's coach connection is now expanding to Portola Middle School and they need

2:57:35money to continue uh in this school year and then to gear up for next year and the money and the notor in the sort of competitiveness they can get by having City support on their Grant programs is pretty critical now as opposed to um waiting until the next fiscal year so

2:57:54my suggestion is that we move forward with the grant now um at some at some level and in the future we could potentially make this program a little bit more known to community groups in our in our city and potentially allocate a small you know five thousand dollars in the or

2:58:14something along those lines in the next budget and have a more thorough competitive process I would venture to Guess that under a competitive process this program would score very highly it's leveraging many many volunteer hours it's reaching hundreds of students

2:58:27it's providing a it has been testified by experts that it's actually an effective program so I I've spoken longer than I intended to and I'd love to hear what you all think about this and I appreciate you you're hearing this thank you um questions or discussions

2:58:49I do have a question um there is a request there are the the policy does uh ask for the application be submitted um has an application been submitted I see Mr It also says under e that a representative would be present when we take this under consideration so I'll

2:59:10ask that representative um did you is have you submitted a written application thanks council member uh Lyman I'm Bob Manson we're the executive director of the writer coach connection program uh no we weren't aware that there was a procedure for formal submission of an

2:59:31application but we would be delighted have you looked at the application and do you think you could fill it out in the next five minutes probably uh although I haven't seen it so it depends on how complicated it is but I filled out a lot of applications I'm an experienced application filler

2:59:49router and thank you for bringing that up I did I did ask our Council about this and he suggested that we in in our direction would direct staff to make this a formalized process so that we could track that whatever we spend is going to the correct group and they're a

3:00:04bona fide group that's operating and Karen wants to jump in and help me it looks like are you currently a co-sponsored group no we're a 501c3 um council members this I believe that this policy designates that these grants are available only to co-sponsored groups they would need to apply to be a

3:00:22co-sponsored group first in order for the grant to be um given to them and that process is what this is for I believe actually I read this pretty carefully and I I think that it that a non-co-sponsored group could seek a grant um but I'll defer I maybe have that

3:00:46wrong go ahead council members um I I was around when we set up this co-sponsored thing it's fine but I I think that we don't need to not do this just to to do that we could in the future do that perhaps but I think for tonight we could just do it on its own merits

3:01:06I I think there are some some merits to the to the to the form I mean there's reporting requirements that that are required in the form so I would like to see a form submitted at some point whether it's before we take action or after we take action I'd be willing to waive that requirement

3:01:25but I do believe that we should get a an application associated with this request just in a um a motion that could cover all that maybe so I make a motion to [Music] um to Grant a twenty five hundred dollar Grant in support of the writer coach connection request for this year with

3:01:51the understanding that there will be a follow-up application to be a co-sponsored group second emotion okay uh discussion on that I had a couple items here would you want to preface that by saying that that if this does pass that the grant will not be uh uh the money of the grant will not be

3:02:17forthcoming until the application is uh fulfilled and approved by the city staff the council what's that the council that has to prove it no we approve this subject to the application being submitted being filled out submitted and approved by the city staff we're directing that if that

3:02:42happens then the council is okay to release the money it's a contingent approval you're asking for a contingent approval tonight correct well I'm not but I'm saying if we want to go forward I would suggest that well the motion I made is is saying that we would do it

3:03:01but they would apply apply for that status I I actually think we can trust the school district yes but but here's the thing all I'm asking is saying that we don't release money until all that that you have proposed is taken care of I concur with that I I don't I don't

3:03:24there's an urgency to release the money quickly I don't have no idea Karen I'm sorry I worked with this um I work with Scott on this and maybe I should have included you as well um so it sounds like what might be helpful is could we move that the city approve a grant to the organization

3:03:44contingent on them satisfactorily filling out the application and Karen are you saying that then we need we need to then take another vote later to approve them as a co-sponsored organization well actually according to this policy and if you read it um as and or funding it does this policy does

3:04:03state that the city council does have to approve that so I mean I Look to Sky reading this perhaps if there's if I'm interpreting that wrong because there are um you know there are documents required there are you know that type of thing and so I just don't want to set

3:04:18any precedent that we're not that the city council isn't following its own policy or that they choose to do so if that's okay so I haven't reviewed the policy in full with an eye toward whether or not in order to qualify for a grant one must also be a co-sponsored

3:04:34group and I'm not sure that within the that's me that I can do that review while we sit here so I mean what I might suggest as um a variation on what I'm hearing as combined sentiments for emotion would be to approve the grant contingent on submitting an application and if

3:04:55necessary submitting an application that includes co-sponsorship that will come back to the council for approval if if it's determined that that's what the policy requires I think that's what I was trying to say and I wonder uh okay I'm sorry we're not at um public comments over with so we're just

3:05:20trying to comment through here right thanks unless we have a question we yeah we haven't we haven't had public comment yet we're still in questions to the most we're at questions to Rebecca and let's stop the motion proceedings and we better go to the public comments

3:05:40so um we'll suspend right where Janet was and we'll go to public comment on this so we have Al Miller Al Miller [address removed] and I'm glad we're all still here uh I volunteer three days a week in an algebra class uh as an in-class tutor if they had a algebra coach connection I

3:06:09would probably be what I'm doing however it's not one-on-one it's the teacher in me and 40 kids in a class I give you that information because one of the benefits of this program that accrues to the city and a cruise to the school district I don't think you've heard about yet

3:06:31Todd tells me we have now a 90 coaches in El Cerrito High School what this means in addition to all of the wonderful things they can do for the students what it's hopefully telling you is that we have 90 people I'm assuming most of them or a lot of them live in El

3:06:51Cerrito that without this program I have no reason to go into school it's been so long since people of even your generation have been in the schools to know how schools are run today what schools are like today most of the kids in El Cerrito High School I shouldn't

3:07:11say most a lot of the kids in El Cerrito High School in Portola don't live in El Cerrito they come from Kensington they come from Richmond they come from I'm sure other places too the attitudes of the youngsters of today are very very different than when I was going to school

3:07:33it's almost accepted behavior in the school not necessarily in the class but in the school and around of how they carry out themselves what they do what they address what they how they talk it's just completely different I think that leads to the great disconnect between the residents of a

3:07:56community and the public schools in that community so the more people we have inside of the schools on a regular basis working one-to-one or working on the kids getting to know the kids to know that most all of them are good kids they want to learn most of them have disadvantages

3:08:16they bring with them me as a educated adult can go in there and help them get to feel good for what I'm doing they get to feel good they got good time on an adult they actually learn to respect another adult who's not a mother or father neighbor uncle or policeman so

3:08:34it's just it's got this two-way street that's really good so I think that anything that the city can do to facilitate it and to ensure it continues to operate and to contribute to the leverage that we've heard about is a great thing thank you thank you any other

3:08:56no matter anybody else would like to talk okay we'll bring it back to council I assume that uh councilmember Abelson would like her motion to stand because can I and can I I just having reviewed this a little bit more closely and just discussing it with the assistant city

3:09:16manager um I mean the council is contemplating um some already contemplating some deviations from the existing policy as written but it does seem that the policy requires the submission of an application as part of the grant process so what I think might work is if I think

3:09:34it's appropriate if the council tonight wants to say yes we are in favor of making this grant but that the application itself should be filled out and come back on the consent calendar um for at the next meeting for approval um and again if there's I don't know

3:09:49whether or not you know the will we have a consent calendar on December 4th so I don't know whether or not those those two weeks delay will be um will harm them in any way but if not then I'd suggest to go ahead and indicate you know it would be fine for the council to indicate it's it's

3:10:09um approval if that's your will to to make the grant off cycle from the budget but that the application should be filled out and come back on the consent calendar at the next meeting so we're not technically we won't approve it tonight but we can indicate our intentions if we so yes I think that I

3:10:25think that would be the best thing to do okay so would that mean I would withdraw I'd suggest withdrawing the motion is made with the consent of the person who made the second second no there wasn't a second okay I seconded but I consent okay I thought there was a second okay

3:10:45okay well uh then let's I'm not you know I do have one comment though when we did this originally I thought the thing about the co-sponsored I thought it was more about the use of rooms not about grants and I didn't read this because of course this was not put given to us ahead of

3:11:06this meeting so I haven't read it recently but that's what I'm remembering was the reason that we created that was to know who could use our rooms at a reduced rate or free the the the the so I'm thinking that this is not even what the co-sponsored chip was actually

3:11:24designed for but the policy as written whether so I I let me just say I think that there are then two issues one is whether or not a group has to be co-sponsored in order to qualify for a grant but that's separate from whether or not the application that's attached

3:11:41to the policy is required to request a grant and the policy does seem to indicate that the application is required for a grant not just for use of City facilities to be co-sponsored is that co-sponsorship is a separate issue from whether or not the application is required to qualify for a

3:12:00grant wait is this the code it's both it's both the policy applies both to co-sponsorship and to Grants however to be clear and to be fair you haven't necessarily taken the time to completely read it but it but the way I've read it and I did read it on BART because it was emailed to us they do not

3:12:21need to be co-sponsored to make a Grant application I get I don't have an opinion on that right now I'm saying that that's a separate issue from whether or not the application is required in order to obtain a grant and as as given from my previous testimony I believe an application needs to be given

3:12:37before we can give the Grant and that's why I was asking if if we if we could fill out an application in five minutes and maybe it would help Mr menzinger can I ask would you be interested in becoming a co-sponsor organization um where you may be able to use facilities for meetings

3:12:55that was the question I I started to pose earlier I I didn't know what co-sponsorship means so that's what it means it means that you would be able to use some City facilities for meetings that are reduced non-profit rates well intent was the so that it could be used for events not for

3:13:13meetings for oh so for um fundraisers and that sort of thing it's sort of getting twisted and um since I didn't have an opportunity to read it since I got it here um although I did look at my email that I got on my city account ahead of time so I don't know when it came but I guess I

3:13:33was asking because I think he probably would want to fill out an application no matter what yes that's certainly true and with regard to facilities would be most especially interested in that since we don't have a central office in facilities for events is a big issue for

3:13:48us I think what we do um there is criteria that has to be met and followed to become a co-sponsorship so I think it's best that you take a look at the policy and the application I I think you'll find that you your group uh will qualify for that but take a look at it and and see what we

3:14:13have is emotion required tonight for us to give you know the applicant or direction to make an application and staff or you know I guess once the applicant application comes in it would go on consent the the only motion that we potentially if I heard the uh city council correctly uh

3:14:33counselor correctly is that we potentially need to take a motion to allow for this to be come out of the fiscal year um 1213 budget I think that it would be helpful to make that motion including the indication that you're willing to accept the application and consider the application

3:14:52so moved tonight we should do that regardless that motion I think doesn't that negate what you just said though that we have to approve yeah sorry I I realize this is getting very confused but um the the in order to approve the Grant I believe the existing policy requires that an

3:15:15application be submitted correct right since an application has not yet been submitted what I would suggest is deferring action on the grant until um that your next meeting when the application can be placed before you as part of the consent calendar correct nevertheless I think that since the

3:15:31policy also says that the council that that applications for Grants should be submitted with the budget cycle I do think a motion tonight indicating that the council would accept an application for a grant off cycle would be appropriate for a grant to be issued in this fiscal

3:15:48year off cycle because because you we could take it now for next fiscal year and that's so I want to make it clear that my motion is for this fiscal year off cycle that's yes both parts are you making the motion or should I and as he said it I said so moved but I

3:16:06I can okay I will go ahead and say that that that there is a motion on the table to accept an application for this grant off cycle with funds to be paid out of this budget should it be approved should it be approved at a subsequent council meeting so moved second I can't I think

3:16:26we're kind of back to what I said originally not quite almost almost okay it's been moved in second and um on the funding uh should the application be prove that a further date that that would come out of this budget cycle correct yes yep all right I'll paraphrased good so on the motion all

3:16:48those in favor aye aye opposed the motion carries I do have though I do have some comments on this and I don't want it to be misconstrued because I um have always supported programs of this sort and and the school but it again brings up um well first of all I think it should really be pointed out

3:17:13and uh it'll be part of probably our action on the consent calendar that this is a I really think that this should just be a one-time Grant and that it should not be expected that this would continue on an ongoing basis that um and the reason is that well just as good

3:17:38policy we don't know if there's going to be money for grants in the future so you don't want to commit money that you may not have [Music] um so I would I would caution you on that the bigger issue though is um and you indicated that uh that more people should know about this and should

3:17:58apply and yet we don't have a program really a grant program we don't have funding for a grant program we don't have dedicated funding for grant program and I do really feel the criteria for Grants is not is is not really there I mean so I would suggest that if the

3:18:19council really wants to get in into the community grant program which I think Rebecca has suggested and it's a good one I think because other cities have done that um that we developed the program and I think that's what Rebecca actually had had suggested that we develop one and we

3:18:41identify funding sources and we go from there there are other my only drawback on this has nothing to do with the program rather granting that granting it or not is this is going to set a precedent in my opinion there's going to be other people wanting to come in and probably

3:19:03just as deserving if not more so of a grant and then how are we going to handle how are we going to handle that [Music] um I don't know and and I do in Janet maybe you recall we gave money to grip one year substantial amounts of money a substantial amount of money

3:19:25um to grip on a one-time well it was one time but I don't know if that was a formal Grant or it was handled some other way I'm not remembering that but it doesn't mean it didn't happen well they came in made a presentation and I believe we uh this was this was when the

3:19:42city um was doing very well financially and we were able to do that because there were residents in the grant program from else from in the grip program from El Cerrito and it was a service that we didn't provide in in the city so um grip used to be uh and I maybe it still

3:20:03is I don't know a program that was run at a number of El Cerrito churches yeah and I know because they were members but it it was running daughter Richmond my daughter was in Girl Scouts at and they met at one of the churches and so um they actually were involved in it so

3:20:25somebody was said earlier that it was a Richmond program it's more that grip is more than a Richmond program well anyway we're not here yeah for grip other than to say so my only caution is um if we're going to get into this um we shouldn't put out false expectations to people that all the

3:20:42city's giving out grants and I'm going to go apply that if we're going to get into it then a program should be formulated and I I think that's what council member benzanini was suggesting so thank you all right that's it for that thank you very much we'll wait for the

3:21:02application to come forward um we did yeah we took action his comments were after the action that's correct question too about these items that come to our meeting the same day um like the administrative policy um I actually read my email at least my city email right before this meeting

3:21:31so um if it had come today there I should have received it and I didn't I received it later so I'm not really sure but it in in general it would be nice if things didn't come the same day because maybe we didn't have time during the day to continue you know to monitor our email

3:21:53that you know that same day so it would be nice if these things came sooner so that we could do that um and then maybe we would have been able to complete this conversation yeah I apologize that's my fault I didn't provide my comments on this item until this morning and that's when I noticed

3:22:11that the attachment the policy was not attached to the agenda item as published so I I noticed that last night I was glad you all right well we're down to uh Council assignments and liaison reports we have three minutes anybody have any reports out I I have one really really quick one

3:22:35tree committee met for the first time and there's a lot of really smart people on the committee and they're looking forward to doing lots of work for us I'm done excellent I have two really quick ones I attended a bag and we had an interesting presentation on um protecting our investments creating a

3:22:59resilient region region and I'll leave it at that and then on the um with Tac I can't remember now because we haven't met every twice a month recently but I'm not sure if everyone knows that the executive director of WIC Tac is leaving the agency for uh to pursue

3:23:22another calling and um so the end of the year will be the end of her term and we're um considering applications for interim employment we actually have a problem with our pers was ruled that we're um we may not be eligible for pers so now they're going through a process to

3:23:46determine if we are but meanwhile it makes it very difficult to hire a an executive director Although our current employees are covered in an interim basis so so there's been a lot going on there but um and I'll leave it at that I just have two quick ones Parks and Rec

3:24:05met and they had a long meeting with a new staff member from the school district who spoke a lot about joint use permit and that is still under negotiations but they're following it very closely and they asked many questions so I want to assure you that that is being vetted by our

3:24:21park and rec committee commission and I also want to mention the arts and culture met and um I'll just mention that there was a lot of interest in the urban Greening advisory body so I think that one will be you know they will decide amongst themselves which of them will attend uh

3:24:38beyond that committee but there's a lot of interest in being on that advisory committee great I have two quick ones one sat in and went to the Integrated Waste Management Authority meeting for council member Lyman and he will be he'll be attending some pretty important meetings

3:25:00in the next couple months but basically um getting down the authority is getting down to the point of making decisions on the future going forward of the authority and that will be coming to the council for further discussion on and Direction on how the city would like to proceed in

3:25:19that Authority it's pretty important The Authority is 20 years old and it's time to either consider to go forward or to disband so that's what's coming up and then the uh Gilman field uh joint Authority will be meeting in January that'll be it okay with that unless

3:25:43there's an objective we're going to adjourn okay we're adjourned thank you for coming stop defense